00:00:00,680 S1: Called over the April 27th meeting of the Mountain Conservation Commission. In attendance for the commission tonight is Ken Whitaker. Geoff Hand saying he'll declare the esteem will hold. We have a strong, um. And I'm Phil, close to the chairperson. Um, the meeting will be recorded, so please don't say anything bad about the chairperson. Um, if you want to be heard, um, raise your hand and, um, recognize you and give your your time. Um, okay. Okay. 00:00:34,320 S2: All right. First up, we've got the public hearing for 255 Grapevine Road. The one, um, Conservation Commission will conduct a public hearing in accordance with the Wetlands Protection Act. Marsh General law, chapter 131, section 40. And the town of Wenham. Water Resources Protection Bylaw, chapter 242. At 7 p.m. on Monday, April 27th, 2026, to discuss the Notice of Intent filed by Gordon College, 255 Grapevine Road one and mass, represented by Waterfield Design Group, Inc., 50 Cross Street, Winchester, mass. To permit the construction of a music center, walkway and maintenance, path reconfiguration, stormwater management structures, landscaping, electrical transformer and generator, and associated accurate. How do you say that? 00:01:18,870 S1: Word for truth. 00:01:20,510 S2: Thank you. Um, within the Conservation Commission. Thank you. True jurisdiction at 255 Grapevine Road. Assessor's map 43, lot one. Plans and accompanying documents can be viewed at the Wenham Land Use Office at 138 Main Street, during regular business hours, online or contacting the office. This meeting is occurring in person at the Wenham Town Hall and via zoom and online meeting platform. Information and instructions on the remote participation is available on the Conservation Commission agenda, which was posted on the town's calendar of events at one Dot gov. Philip Russo chairman and this was published in the H.W. news Friday, April 17th, 2026. 00:02:07,109 S2: I just want to make sure, um, iPhone eight, I just want to make sure. Can you hear and see us? 00:02:16,669 S1: Yes. 00:02:17,069 S3: Sorry about that. This is Jim Gary with Walsh Brothers. I was having some computer issues, so I needed to log in to my phone. 00:02:24,189 S2: Oh, great. No problem. I just want to make sure you can hear. Thank you. 00:02:29,949 S1: Okay, great. So, uh, good evening. Uh, Conservation commission. I am Jacob Murray from Marshall Design Group, where the civil engineer and landscape architect on the project, the Adams Center for music, which is the official name of the project. Now, uh, for Gordon College, 255 Grapevine Road. Also this night, uh, Robert and Amanda from Epstein. Jocelyn, the architect, uh, and then Deborah and Ethan from Accenture, a center of the project manager and then Christian from Gordon College. And a couple of people, I believe, from Walsh Brothers, the contractor are with us remotely online, as there's already a contractor on board, and we're ready to ready to build the city to get through permitting and through classes this year that that trouble you just to give us their last names, too? Oh, yes. So Robert McCarty from Joslyn McCarty architects, Amanda Delevingne, Ethan Butler. 00:03:24,819 S4: Deborah. Mariah. 00:03:28,379 S1: Yeah. Um, I'll actually have, um, Robert and Amanda kind of give a brief overview of the building and the renderings and kind of what's going on here, and then I can, uh, walk you through the site issues and the conservation issues, uh, and then open the questions. 00:03:46,219 S4: Uh, so what you see here is a rendering of the new, um, Adam Center. It's directly in the center of the campus. So this sidewalk that you can see connects through the thoroughfare of the campus down to the chapel, which is on the west side of this building. Um, the building itself neighbors the existing Philips Music School and, and is a separate new construction building, though it does have some physical connections to that existing building. This building expands both the music and the arts department serving the campus and the broader community, with a large concert hall on the right side there. So that's a 500 seat performance hall, as well as lobby and support spaces in the center, and then educational spaces, um, an ensemble rehearsal room and a classroom on the upper level with additional educational spaces on the basement level. So two storeys above ground and then placement below. 00:04:47,569 S1: Sheila and I should go to the next slide. So, David? 00:04:51,810 S4: Yeah. Again, looking through the center of the canvas back towards the chapel. Um, the building is all accessed from the ground level, um, here. And then connected back to the Philip's building behind it. Um, with some public spaces in front connecting me to the concert hall on the inside there. And the materiality of the building. 00:05:13,769 S1: As you can see, it's all brick. And we have flat roofs. 00:05:17,970 S4: With ePDM roofing. 00:05:19,410 S1: And. 00:05:19,810 S4: We're capturing all of the roof. 00:05:21,170 S1: Water and tying it into the. 00:05:22,850 S4: Low grade drainage. 00:05:24,129 S1: System. So we don't have any, uh. 00:05:26,209 S4: Water from. 00:05:26,850 S1: The building going on. 00:05:27,730 S4: To the. 00:05:27,970 S1: Site paths and area around the building. So where does that give me? Downspouts? Yes. Let me. Well, it's a flat roof, so a collect inside and come out from underneath. Okay. Is that an aesthetic choice or is that an engineering choice? Uh, I think both. Yeah, yeah. But then it's aesthetic for us, that we love it. Like I hate downspouts. I'd much prefer to have something coming from outside the building. I can control where it comes. I don't have a bunch of piping around the building, so you can move on to the next slides just kind of give you the whereabouts. This is the existing conditions plan. So there we go. So Koi Pond is our wetland. We then have Prince Meer Drive. We then have which is, you know, there within 20, 30ft of the wetlands, we have the 50 foot institutional limit of work, the 7570 foot institutional no build line that you see there, the 100 foot wetland buffer that goes through the existing, uh, Phillips Center. And all this area here is there's some landscaping, but it's not it's not natural. It's all lawn, etc.. And then the here it's natural on the other side of Prince Drive, which is an internal road. And then you have the existing Philip music building. So this is our general site as it is now. And then you can go to the next slide. 00:06:43,879 S5: Speaking thing. 00:06:45,759 S1: So the new building is here. It's about 1500ft². Uh, 15. Sorry, 15,000ft². Uh, and most of it, as you can see, is, uh, and really, most of the work is within a 100 between the 100 and 200 foot. This building is being built on top of existing walkways. Uh, and we're basically just kind of we're expanding the building, put putting a new building, uh, and then moving the walkways so that the main thoroughfare is over here and that the associated path to lane and to to the cafeteria and to the other buildings are reconfigured with a bit of a plaza here. Uh, and then also another one on the internal area as well. So you can get there. Yeah. Uh, actually, no work is proposed. Just to note, within the 75, sorry, 70 and 50 foot areas, uh, there's small areas of transformer and generators that are kind of being put in the back of the building that will be landscaped around as well. Uh, within the 100 foot area just on the bench. Excuse me. All of the, uh, the. 00:07:45,790 S6: New stuff is new? 00:07:47,029 S1: Yes. All the color stuff is my company. I do that side. So. 00:07:56,949 S1: I mentioned it's a mix of redevelopment and new development, because it is increasing the impervious area by about 14,800ft², with the new building taking up a lot of footprint where there were some vegetated areas. We are going to meet all the state and local requirements for drainage by proprietary separators and then underground infiltration chambers. The site actually has a very good sandy alluvium, soils that are that are native to the area. And so we anticipate very good infiltration and cleaning of the water as well through that process. Uh, the other utilities in general will have to there's internal campus made for water line that'll be going around the edges. Electronic, electrical and telecom are both. This is the main thorough way for them. So they'll be connecting off of. Off of them as well. And then sewer will come out to the building to the existing main that goes, then pumps down to Grapevine Road. So they'll be here. We're showing 44 underground infiltration chambers. Uh, then you can go to the next slide to show landscaping. 00:09:07,779 S1: So the site is removing 14 trees within the 200 foot buffer zone. So within that area we are replacing with 19 trees, many that are closer. So I guess the only work I would say that we are within the 70 foot, uh, no build line is to re-educate the area and replace lawn area with some new proposed trees. So and those are all native species that are, are, are going to be an upgrade over to what is existing there and be able to kind of grow into the area as well. As they mature, they all start at at least two and a half, three inches in diameter and work from there. So could I ask a couple of things? I appreciate you expanding on jurisdiction. We don't have a 70 foot belt, so there is not only 30ft, but what do you want to do? I'm excited. I'm not going to argue. I'll have to check what I said in the regulation. But, um, could you, um, give us the, you know, the species of trees you're talking about here? Um, if we go down to the corner and we can see them. 00:10:14,049 S2: To the. 00:10:14,370 S1: Left? Yeah. To left. 00:10:15,610 S4: Here. 00:10:16,049 S1: Right. Yes, sir. Whatever we want. So got typical, uh, autumn. Brilliant. Serviceberry. Palestine. American hornbeam, eastern redbird, uh, golden glory cherry. So I guess what I'm after is they're all native. They're all native? Yes. Sorry if I mentioned that. Yeah. Not decorative. Okay. Yeah. 00:10:37,529 S4: Are you a place you said you were placing it with 19 faces. 00:10:40,330 S1: Yeah, we're losing 14 and we're replacing the 19. 00:10:42,529 S4: And are the 14 that you're losing is sort of like a proportional split between evergreen and deciduous shrub. 00:10:51,009 S1: Yes, yes. And we're trying to get that through. Yes. No. And that's actually that's actually documented here. So it looks like three evergreens are being moved and being taken down. Very replaced with nine evergreens. 11 deciduous are being taken down. They're being replaced with 11 deciduous. 00:11:14,970 S1: If they said close to the screen next time. And so that in general is the project, uh the walkways uh will be there are walkways there. These will be, um reconfigured. There's actually some more landscaping outside, uh, the 200 foot, just for the beauty of the campus as well. Those are native species as well. Um, so it's it's a project that's not. We're not encroaching on any type of wooded area. This is all lawn. It's existing campus. We're bringing the building this way instead of moving it towards the pond and limiting that that keeping that area. Yeah. Creating really even more of a wooded area in there with the landscaping that will be added. We're also going for zoning board appeals on Wednesday for site plan review. 00:12:03,480 S4: So they, um, transformer and the generator, are there other things that will be in that zone? 00:12:12,440 S1: No, just to the the transformer, the generator. And then there'll be electrical lines that'll come back into campus from them to, to, uh, power the building. Well, both ground or both above ground. They'll have to be access for maintenance, uh, on a regular, semi-regular basis. And if you go below ground, then there's got to be confined space entry every time you got to It's not. It's not. Nobody willing to do it. And it's it's more expensive. And it's also actually a whole lot less safe. Obviously have people go into a transformer that have to maintain with that type of power that's in there in the area. What is the excuse me, what is going to be happening with the spoils that are going to come out over all the construction? Um, so they'll be taken off site. Only being in storage on site. What's going on? Yeah, I can I don't know if someone from Walsh is online. They might be able to better, uh, they were getting the soil characterization testing lined up right now. Okay. And all construction equipments could be coming in. From what direction? From the. Coming in. From the street by koi pond. They will be coming in through Prince, through Prince Mir. And they will have a construction entrance that they'll be cleaning the truck before they leave it, before they leave the site. Uh, if you want to go up to, um, actually, I don't think I. Yeah. So the main entrance way because of where situated Grapevine Road is down here. But that's not really a great access way. So there will be vehicles coming in off of Princeton. You're out here. So is there going to be any sort of assuming the trucks will be cleaned when they exit and enter the property, but while they're traversing from here to the entrance and exit, um, they could be sitting by one wall there. So the, the construction, the, um, the construction and the cleaning, what will be around will be at the parking area. So any if they're there will be dirty while they're in this area. But this will have they'll be uh, to be surrounded with hay bales. And I think actually if we go down past the color plans, I get to the site prep and development plan. Obviously, we're always going, well, there's going to be a need for any sort of, um, yeah, remediation along the so we go there, go upwind. Okay. That would be there. Nope. Sorry. Keep down. 00:14:33,379 S4: So, Jim, do you want to add to this conversation? Because I know you've thought about the logistics. 00:14:38,299 S1: Do you go down. 00:14:38,980 S4: One step with Lost Brothers, the contractor? Yeah, I'd like to hear, too, about a staging area like where supplies and materials would be. 00:14:48,980 S3: Deb, do you have a do you have a logistics plan that you could pull up? 00:14:52,899 S4: I don't think we have that here, do we? 00:14:55,379 S1: Yeah. I wouldn't be part of the middle. 00:14:56,779 S4: Yeah, I'm trying to smell. 00:14:58,899 S3: But we have a full logistics plan that we have, uh, you know, that we had submitted and will submit with the town. We could we could certainly get that to you. Um, but, uh, everything will be staged within our construction zone, which is in and around the new building itself. All trucks are coming off of 128, um, directly to the site. And then at each gate, we'll have, uh, we'll watch stations, riprap, um, as well as, um, street sweepers during heavy trucking, uh, operations. At the moment, we're working through some, decisions with the school, whether you know how much soil will be stockpiled on site and reused, or what will be removed and then brought back. 00:15:41,570 S1: Those squiggly lines are the yeah. So here this is the erosion control. Not so soft. And then everything else is kind of obviously covered in building. What's the uh it's the grade there. It started the grade. Yeah. So in the, in the general, uh, building area, it's very flat. And then after you, even the parking lot is rather flat. And then there is a steep drop off down here once you get off the site beyond the limit at work. So the original trails at the top of the grade. Yes. 00:16:16,769 S1: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The chair recognizes me. I have a couple of questions. Uh, a couple of questions for the architect. Uh, the landscape architect. What's the name of your company? Waterfield design Group, say the Waterfield Design Group. Waterfield. Waterfield. Waterfield design Group feels like a field you knew with with with. Uh, with Gordon College. Yeah, we've done a number of projects with them. And in the last 2 or 3 years I have even before that. Uh, even before that, I seen with Ben Gary. With your company? No. Ben Gary was the landscape architect before, uh, before Gordon. But that was, uh, I met him 20 years ago, so it was a while ago. Uh. 00:17:00,809 S1: If I heard it right that there's there's no activity within the 100 foot buffer zone, is there heavy trucks within that buffer zone? And and the the heavy trucks with the buffer zone are just heavy trucks on an internal campus road on one on roads that are already already paved, already used for, for for sometimes heavy trucks like that. Yes. 00:17:25,720 S3: Correct. 00:17:26,799 S1: I wonder if, uh, if if that's the case and if any planting done in the, in the buffer zone is, is native trees. You're adding trees and landscaping. Why? Why didn't you, uh, apply for a determination and of applicability instead of, uh. Does it? It's a it's a pond. So it's a 212, and it's a 200. I see. Alright. Thank you. 00:17:55,880 S4: Or one of these documents. 00:17:57,039 S1: So I don't know if we. 00:17:59,039 S4: Um, this is a submission. 00:18:02,359 S1: For the logistics plan. I don't know, I don't I can talk somewhat to it. 00:18:06,960 S5: If you want to bring up the other. I believe the question, the open question is on the lay down area. 00:18:13,319 S3: Jordan, can you send the logistics plan to Deb so she can pull it up? 00:18:18,599 S4: I probably won't be able to that up. 00:18:20,880 S3: Okay. 00:18:21,240 S4: Sorry, I don't have the no. 00:18:22,839 S5: I can do so at the south of here, um, is, uh, Chase Hall. So essentially we'll be, uh, there's a kind of an open field in between the main thoroughfare and, uh, Chase Hall right now. So the thought is to kind of, um, have construction fencing around there, and that will be the main lead on areas kind of the central south area of the plan right here. 00:18:44,430 S1: And also there was a recently. 00:18:46,069 S4: Removed. 00:18:46,670 S1: Building that was on campus, and they have a kind of an empty lot to the left of Chase Hall. And using that lot as well for staging. Um, there'll be no staging within the within the hundred foot area. I haven't had a chance to review these drawings before, but my understanding is the only intrusion that you have is the transformers and the power station in general. So they have the upper left and the upper right. Yes. And outside of that, all that activity is essentially separated from the hundreds of buffalo by existing buildings. Yes. Okay. Here's the building that will erosion control and the two areas in between. Okay. Okay. 00:19:29,309 S1: So the plans you submitted are pre application plans. They're not filed. They are final plans. Yeah. That's what they say. Oh yeah. We had to take that off. But I know we're in touch with Kate about that. So. So we're going to have final plans. Yeah. Yeah. 00:19:45,829 S2: And can you send us the logistics plan as well? 00:19:47,990 S4: Yes. Great. 00:19:50,509 S5: Um. 00:19:52,430 S1: Any more questions from the commission this time? The only thing I. Well, maybe I'll get my only suggestion. If we can allow, uh, periodic inspections by UK or somebody from us just to make sure that their construction and you know that, uh, the motion controls are still properly maintained. What's their condition? I think so. So hard hat. Yeah, I lost my older ones. That was, um. That's pretty common, I see. So, um, is there I know there there are. There's someone on line who wants to make a statement. So I'll open up to the audience if anyone would like to be heard. And would you like to read your letter into the record? 00:20:41,819 S7: Yes I would. Um, my name is Ann Jarrod. I live at 821 Bay Road in Hamilton. Um, I am a member of the steering committee of a group called h w dark Sky. I have another member of the steering committee on the call as well with me tonight, Kathy Simons. Um, and we have questions about the proposed lighting. So, um, this group, h w dark Sky, it's an ad hoc citizens group that's advocating for reasonable lighting practices in Hamilton and Wenham and. On behalf of H.W. dark Sky, Cathy and I are offering our comment letter as follows. The proposed music center will be built in an environmentally sensitive area next to Koi Pond and within wetland buffer areas, as well as the 200 foot pond buffer zone, which collectively we're calling the buffer areas. Excessive nighttime lighting will have a detrimental impact on the protected wildlife and wildlife habitat in these areas. It has been shown in numerous studies that artificial light at night negatively impacts plants, migrating birds, insects including fireflies, bats, salamanders, and toads. For example, trees can drop their leaves later in the season, and certain insects and bats will avoid the area entirely. Other insects are attracted to or become confused in the presence of artificial light, and as a result, change their behavior to their detriment. The plans submitted to the Conservation Commission show exterior lighting in the form of bothered lights, big A light poles, and campus standard light poles. But for details on those light fixtures, the plans then refer the reader to an illumination plan and I believe, in one instance, a lighting plan. Yet the applicant failed to include an illumination plan or lighting plan in its submittal, at least as far as I could see. So for the above reasons, we request that all new exterior lights at the project follow international dark Sky guidelines. And to that end, we ask that all exterior lights, the new lights should be pointed downward and be fully shielded. Have a color temperature of no more than 2700 Kelvin to minimize glare. Have an intensity that's no more than necessary to serve the purpose of the lights and, where practicable, be turned off and operate on motion detectors at night. We've also understood and have seen from a rendering here tonight, that the music Center will have large glass windows looking out over the landscape. We request that these windows be equipped with some sort of shades or blinds that are closed at dusk, so the music center doesn't light up the night environment. We believe that the Music Center will be a wonderful addition to the community. However, it should be constructed in a manner that, to the extent feasible, minimizes its impact on wildlife and wildlife habitat within the buffer areas. We thank you for your consideration. If you have any questions, please let us know or you can reach out to us at the email address that's noted in the in the memo that I've submitted. 00:24:11,200 S1: We can't say I know that they are in general there, pointed down downwards and they are seek to be fully shielded. I think for these other ones we'll have to look into them. I don't know about the kelvins of the of the proposed lights. We could have the illumination plan and the definitely, you know, we can work where practical. Although it's college campus safety is obviously their primary goal. And so they will they can they will want those lights to be on as necessary to make sure the students are safe. So but we can we can respond to this letter and provide more information as well. Okay. Is there anyone else in the audience who wants to be heard? Yes. Uh, I'm just interested. 00:24:54,869 S4: I saw you state your name. 00:24:57,029 S1: Andreas Hansen. 00:24:58,390 S5: 26. 00:24:58,950 S1: Main Street. And I'm just curious, in terms of landscaping, I saw on the list that. 00:25:04,549 S5: There was a. 00:25:04,950 S1: Naturalized daffodil bulb section in terms of the all plants. Uh, is that just from the difficulty of getting spring ephemera rolls that I needed from a nursery, or what was that decision? Yes, I believe that was it. Yeah. Yeah. Which is the harder the you have to you have to, um, you have to propose them as practical to keep the contract you can get. So yes. The contract. Well, we don't I don't know that we have that yet. We're not that far. We have a general contract, but not all of it. All right. 00:25:37,269 S1: But I just we're used to, uh, the concern that. Are you concerned about. Oh, no, I'm just in general. I find spring festivals are really hard to find when it comes to native alternatives. I don't find daffodils, um, necessarily problematic. It just. If if we could find truly native spring bulbs, that would be nice. But they are hard to find, so I fully understand why that choice is made. Um, yeah, I understand difficulty myself, so. Okay. Just trying to get my arms around. 00:26:17,059 S1: Okay. Is there anyone else want to be heard on this? 00:26:20,819 S8: Um, I can't find my little flag to raise my hand, but this is Cathy. 00:26:28,259 S1: Go ahead. Cathy. 00:26:29,539 S8: Okay. I just was a little bit unclear about about the response. Um, I guess there's going to be a lighting plan, um, provided, but, um, and and some efforts made to, um, provide, um, lighting that has, uh, full shielding. But there wasn't a response to the issue of, uh, color temperature. Um, uh, or, um. Uh, total, um, you know, the, the brightness of, of the lights, um, or any response to the request that they'd be, uh, in keeping with, uh, to, to the degree possible with, um, with dark sky recommendations. Um, so I just wasn't clear about what the next steps were going to be for. Um, and this is for the commission to determine, but whether, uh, there were going to be responses to those issues as well. 00:27:35,529 S1: It's my understanding. And correct me if I'm wrong, is, uh, the commission will be receiving an illumination plan which will hopefully address, um, all or most of these points. They'll become part of the public record so the public can then review them and comment further if they see fit to do so. 00:27:56,849 S4: Yeah. Um, from the architects also, Amanda will be speaking the lighting designer land. Um, their documents were not included, but they will include the color, temperature and the intensity of the lights on their documentation, and we'll have them provide a statement on best practices for dark skies and how these relate to those practices, so we're happy to submit that in response. 00:28:22,569 S8: Thanks very much. 00:28:24,730 S2: Cathy. Can you just state your address for the record, please? 00:28:27,450 S8: 245 Sagamore Street in Hammond in Hamilton. 00:28:31,970 S4: Thank you. 00:28:32,890 S8: Thank you. 00:28:37,329 S1: Hey, unless there's any more questions on this matter, um, I would like to hear a motion to continue. So move, Mr. Chairman. Second. Um, so do you think you can get all this information to us by the next meeting? Yes, definitely. Okay. Which is. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Um, so the motion is to continue into the 11th meeting. So moved. 00:29:06,319 S9: Again. Mister chairman. 00:29:08,240 S1: All in favor, Ken. All right. Jeff. Hi, Jackie. 00:29:11,720 S4: Yes. 00:29:12,359 S1: Liam. Yes. And Lord. Yes as well. All right. Thank you. Thank you. 00:29:17,640 S4: Thank you. Well. 00:29:18,720 S1: You're here to stay for the invasive plants inspection. 00:29:26,359 S4: We could, but then we might have some challenges. 00:29:31,119 S4: How are you doing tonight? Thank you for coming. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 00:29:36,559 S1: I understand I can stay for the airport. Yeah. Actually, thank you all. 00:29:43,680 S4: Thank you. 00:29:44,240 S1: You can work with the panel. I don't know if I'm going to find out. 00:29:50,640 S4: I don't have an update on that. I don't know if. 00:29:54,960 S1: I can send it to you. 00:29:56,400 S4: Yeah. 00:29:57,359 S1: On, on. We're doing like this. They're going to like us. it's not a thing. The MBTA station in Beverly Hills. Yeah. And then we're going to go to the airport, and they're building that massive thing that just happened. They have never seen it. No, they don't use it for it. What are they building at the airport? On the on the west side. They they're building a massive and a hangar. Hangar. 00:30:26,069 S9: Is that in Danvers? That Danvers? 00:30:29,589 S1: It is. Wow. Where you can park your airplane. Right. All right, so you want to share your update on the airport? 00:30:39,670 S2: Yeah. So next up is discuss the expanded environmental notification form filed with the Executive Office of Energy and Environmental Affairs by the Beverly Airport Commission. So really, I just wanted to update on the meeting that we had with Nepa. Um, so, um, as you know, you all signed the letter to the applicant, Beverley Airport, and we had some questions, uh, regarding the expansion that is going to happen at the airport runway. The runway expansion? Yeah. Um, and they would also fill 13,000/13,000 isolated vegetated wetlands. And so. 00:31:21,150 S1: Um, there's. 00:31:22,630 S2: 13,000ft². No, not 13,000. 00:31:25,269 S4: Yeah. 00:31:27,109 S2: Correct. So basically, I just wanted to let you guys know that we had a meeting with them. There was a response and we had a meeting with them. Um, some of the things I took away from this and maybe the two would like to also say some things, but, um, one of the biggest things that I thought could solve the problem would be to use the arrestor beds that fill had mentioned, um, instead of expanding the runway and filling the wetlands. And basically they told us that that's probably not going to happen. So I think their exact words were. They're not great for smaller aircrafts. So safety wise they're not great. Um they're higher cost. So cost wise it's not, um, great either. And basically they're saying that the federal they're these these are federal resources and they would wouldn't probably go for that. So that was the biggest thing I took out of it. Um, what did you guys want to say anything. 00:32:22,819 S1: I would preorder those as if the cost too much was the real way. Yeah. And then the others. Well, I think that that was the chairman. 00:32:32,779 S9: It's. There's a lot of acreage on that airport. Did they did they, uh, mention, uh, or was it a replication plan suggested? Is there's plenty of room for application replication? I don't know if they've considered it. 00:32:47,460 S1: They have considered it. They we haven't seen anything. They said when they come to us during the permitting process that having mitigation. a replication. Yes. I mean, there would be a lot more chance that we would. We would. We would be positive about the situation. If they're going to replicate 13,000ft² on whatever, they're more or more than, than than if they don't. 00:33:20,849 S1: It's complicated a little bit by the fact that it's all with the exception of one small piece, if I recall, it's all within fence lines. Yeah, yeah. So in terms of wildlife impact, you know, but they don't get credit for that. I understood, as I said at the meeting. Yeah. Just because wildlife use is limited, because of the presence of the airport, we're not giving them a discount on the replication. So there are tools that we have. 00:33:53,809 S4: Yeah. 00:33:54,210 S2: So now it's going through the process and we wait. What do they say a year? Maybe they'll come back to us with the notice of intent. So it's a ways off. 00:34:04,250 S4: Are there any opportunities there instead of replication for enhancement of other wetlands that are in that area? 00:34:11,650 S1: So to be honest with you. 00:34:12,889 S4: I know. 00:34:14,090 S1: I would be perfectly okay with them. Like doing something fully offsite or even preserving open space somewhere else in town, as opposed to trying to create a half acre freshwater wetland somewhere and wind up, which is 40% wetlands. The chairman yeah, you know, as much as we we we, uh, we guide and we cherish our jurisdiction. Uh, if, if, if, if any application that doesn't pose, uh, doesn't pose significant. 00:34:56,440 S1: Adverse effect to our jurisdiction. I don't think that we ought to inhibit that. Inhibit, inhibit progress for the for the for the good of of of the. We talk to you about Gordon that we talked about the airport. Yeah I'm talking about the airport. And that's what we're talking about now okay. Because pretty much filling wetlands, you don't get any more negative impact than that. No, no. But if they if they replicate what you just mentioned more than more than they, they, they disturb then then we we could be ahead of the game I environmental. Yeah. I don't disagree that that. 00:35:35,360 S1: As far as Gordon as far as Gordon this doesn't seem to be too much activity and have jurisdiction. I don't know where the center cent a line of the of the of the point is. But what if if if they admit that it's within 200 They're within 200ft. Then then they they should apply for a notice of intent. Yeah. Given the 70ft of bill to thank you for recognizing me tonight. Yeah. When I, when I raise my hand, there's the only one who does. Yeah. Well, you know, it's only it's only courtesy that that anybody whether they're, whether they're a visitor or a, uh, uh, a commission or they, they should, they should, uh, ask to be recognized instead of just follow his lead, instead of just putting their voice in their opinions without being recognized. The two things there is a lot of information available, uh, dug out a lot of stuff over the past week about noise, about being sophisticated. So I got to give them credit. They've done a very thorough job of wiring this program up. Uh, what I find particularly frustrating is the fact that they say that they'll follow FAA regulations until they don't. Yeah. Yeah. About. Well, to the greatest extent practical. Those are the rules that they're playing and they're taking advantage. So I think we should push hard on getting replication. But depending on their views, it's going to be tough to have any impact on the system. 00:37:12,789 S2: Great. 00:37:13,389 S1: You know, excuse me, Mr. Chairman. Yeah. Just a comment. Uh, we have this letter from from Hamilton William Dax guy. Uh, I've never heard of him, and I'm ashamed that I haven't. And they make some points that that I hadn't considered in the past. And and and and I think that that maybe it's something we should know more about and consider in the future. Well, I agree, and I had to when I got the letter, I had to go look up on the bylaws to see if we have the authority to address those type of issues. And the way I read the bylaw. I think we do. We do. So. Yeah. So, um, I also noticed in the Hamilton one, um, news that they were also involved in the solar array that's going opposed at the high school, and they were talking about lighting underneath that too. So they were actually in the Hamilton News discussing lighting for that project within Hamilton. And it is a big thing. Actually, I was watching the PBS NewsHour the other night, and they were talking about in Denmark, they've got a whole roadway system that designed around the dark sky tissue that is red, the color it's, you know, on demand type of deal. Everything is shielded. And it's, uh, you know, trying to trying to gain a lot more traction on this, because it is a problem with the wildlife and how it interferes with their natural activities. But if you go to, I'm sure you're familiar this you go to Florida and all those the beaches and the turtles. Yes. Yeah. Along those lines, perhaps we can invite members of that Dark Side Commission to come in and educate us a little bit about maybe developing some type of position paper or guidelines he's developed by incorporate these into some projects. 00:39:13,530 S2: Yeah, I mentioned that to an today. And they're going to also talk to Hamilton as well. So she said that they'd be in touch. 00:39:19,329 S1: Great. Good idea Mr. Chairman. You also mentioned that you check the the regulations of how does that apply to the Conservation Commission, both in those dark spots. I mean, we're in charge of the water. Any activity that impacts resources, including wildlife habitat under our jurisdiction, according to the bylaws. Um, the activities are not limited to arranging and filling the allotments so any activity related to the project. So I would interpret that to include lighting. And there's also a clause in there that we can require a wildlife habitat study on the time of the payment to be necessary. So wonderful. 00:40:07,250 S4: I wonder. 00:40:07,650 S1: If. 00:40:08,289 S10: That means only, uh, animal animal life. That's that's habitat is our jurisdiction. In other words, there is some, some animals that are outside our jurisdiction that don't don't enter our jurisdiction. But things like whether they be whether they be otters or seals or whether they be. 00:40:31,610 S1: Can we get a ceiling on that are going to be. 00:40:34,010 S4: Yeah. 00:40:35,090 S1: I mean, sea level rise is not either. 00:40:38,929 S10: But we do we have we have the Bishop cats and. 00:40:42,360 S1: Yeah, we do. Yeah. 00:40:44,440 S4: So, Mr. Chairman. Go ahead. So I also would, um, suggest looking into this matter a little deeper. And so if the lights are outside of our jurisdictional zone, do we then do we still have authority to regulate how those lights may affect the aquatic resource of the animal? 00:41:09,199 S2: It might be something to talk about the planning board with, because they're redoing the subdivision rules and regulations right now, which includes lighting. Um, so that actually might be it might be a perfect time. Yeah. 00:41:21,920 S4: It'd be good to have clarity on that. Um. 00:41:24,840 S1: I think any any aquatic wildlife. So I can think of salamanders guard, you know, obviously using the water, but then spend a lot of their life, you know, in the negative. Um. 00:41:44,269 S1: I would argue they would give us first aid changes because they use the resource. And I yeah. Lawyer. And they say that I think that might. 00:41:55,230 S10: Be a bit of a stretch. 00:41:56,590 S1: But what I'll do to the extent that I can. Is I'll do a little research and see if I can find any other conservation commissions or town that have stretched their wetlands regulations to address light pollution outside of the jurisdiction in. 00:42:12,670 S1: Question. All right. Okay. Next. 00:42:17,670 S2: Um, next up, we have discussion and potential vote to approve the final conservation and restrictions for 951 Maple Street. So we're just going to move this on to I don't know if everybody saw their email today, but Monday, May 4th at 4 p.m. we'll do a quick zoom. Um, there was a change in the conservation restriction. So there's two conservation restrictions now. You guys have the draft of both of them. And that is only because the castle that's um, the caretakers house parcel doesn't connect to the rest of the conservation restriction area there, doesn't connect to the rest of the 100 plus acres. So the state made us put it into two conservation restrictions. Um, not a big deal. Uh, then Greenbelt had a few more changes that they wanted to make. And so those changes still need to be approved by the state. So we're going to be Monday at four to approve those. I'll get them to you as soon as possible. Very minimal changes. The biggest thing is, is that Greenbelt wanted to be able to put a fence in a gate up to separate the mansion property from the conservation restriction, so people are not driving up the driveway into the mansion property. Um, so that's why they wanted to make that change. so you'll get it soon. Hopefully the state will approve that quick change. Besides that, everything else is pretty much the same. And we'll meet Monday at four via zoom. I'll send you the agenda. 00:43:46,059 S1: Okay. One comment. Um, I. 00:43:47,619 S10: Think. 00:43:48,460 S1: The maps you have given us are prepared. I don't know that there appeared to be some errors on them on the on the abundant properties. Okay, so you might want to get some of these checked out to make sure that those references are right, because the numbers don't square with the right of records as well. 00:44:04,659 S2: So on the right field road and the ones around. 00:44:09,059 S10: It. 00:44:09,380 S1: Main Street and Laurel drive. Are you saying that the Whitaker Estate is downsized? Yeah, they did, but the taxes remain the same. But as an example, the book notes, for example, they live on 97, but they also had them owning another property that backed up to that property that belongs to somebody else who bought it. So that's just, you know, it's not a big started. Yeah, but I think they just need to make sure it's correct. And does the mansion been advertised yet? 00:44:38,769 S2: Yes. 00:44:39,849 S1: Is there a price on it? 1.66. 00:44:43,690 S4: Yeah. 00:44:43,889 S1: That's a little bit less than. How close? How close does that come to reducing our our commitment. 00:44:51,610 S2: So we're not reducing our commitment at all. 00:44:54,929 S1: Um, it's they're going to have the fundraiser. And I thought they thought maybe some if they got enough, some of our commitment could be saved towards towards the the route 97 project. Angelina. 00:45:07,889 S2: Angelina. So now that it's in the conservation restriction, we are stuck with paying that amount of money. So it would have had to have been earlier where we got any funding back. Um, but they did put it up for 1.6 and we'll see. 00:45:20,730 S1: No developments on Angelina farm. 00:45:23,570 S2: Not right now. I'm in contact with the, um, people at Angelina Farm and they are still working. You know, throughout. They're a bunch of trustees. They're wonderful. They're very open. 00:45:36,130 S1: So they're committed. 00:45:37,289 S4: To. 00:45:37,449 S1: You. 00:45:37,849 S2: Absolutely. 00:45:38,369 S1: As much as anybody. Yes. 00:45:39,530 S2: Absolutely. 00:45:40,050 S1: Yeah. Great. That's good to hear. Yeah. 00:45:41,889 S2: And they're back in chapter. Um so they're doing great. They're farming. Potter's farm is farming up there. So status quo. 00:45:50,489 S1: Mr. chairman, I wanted to just mention that I was at the, um, 99 Maple Walk the sidewalk day and, um, they did he did talk about fundraising and they had it. They said they had about $30,000 a month. 00:46:04,329 S2: And Chris just told me, um, a couple days ago they finished fundraising. So they were all said, I should have I should have led with that. They're all done. 00:46:10,929 S1: Yeah, that was that to Ken for this change? 00:46:12,650 S4: Yeah. 00:46:13,849 S1: Was there any public discussion? 00:46:17,690 S1: I don't know. So, um, so I'm going to sell off the house and the ten acres for 1.6, 15 acres. 15 acres. 00:46:24,610 S2: That's what they put it out there for. 00:46:26,090 S1: Wow. That's a big deal. 00:46:28,880 S2: Yeah. And it will have a it needs a lot of work. 00:46:32,039 S1: Yeah. 00:46:32,960 S2: But they'll have a, um, a historical restriction on it that will also include the acreage around it. So nothing else can be built on it. 00:46:41,719 S1: So it must be based primarily on the professional version. Yeah. 00:46:46,159 S4: Yeah. 00:46:47,079 S2: And then they're going to hold in a trust the other parcel. So, um, the caretaker's parcel and they'll still be working with habitat when they did the test pits out there for the septic because habitat was looking to hopefully do six units out there. Um, the land can only take two more units, so they'll be three if habitat can do it. So they'll be the caretakers house will be redone, and then there'll be two more units out there. 00:47:19,199 S1: Although they haven't had this on time before the CPC looking for funding on that. They've decided to wait until plants got a little bit cluttered. They ordered. 00:47:28,829 S2: You got it. Exactly. Yeah. So that would be a slow process. And so Greenbelt has said they'll hold on to it to see, you know, if habitat they'll give habitat first shot and if not they'll just sell it to a normal developer. 00:47:46,190 S4: Thank you. 00:47:46,789 S2: Yeah. 00:47:47,030 S1: Okay. 00:47:47,909 S2: All right. 00:47:48,630 S1: Habitat. Excuse me. Habitat. We used it for several dwellings. 00:47:53,269 S2: So the septic. There can only be three total dwellings. So they were looking at six before maybe four. And now they're looking at two more and be behind the tree line. You won't really be able to see them. 00:48:06,349 S1: But habitat would be interested even with three units. 00:48:09,150 S2: And they're they're working into it. They'll go to the town for CPC. They'll go to a affordable housing. 00:48:14,429 S1: It's affordable. 00:48:15,710 S2: There are the affordable houses. 00:48:16,989 S1: Yeah, 1.6 million for three. Affordable. 00:48:19,710 S2: No. So that they wouldn't pay that they would pay like 400,000. But, you know, the greenbelt would give them more of a deal. Um, and so, uh, the president of habitat told me that each of their homes cost about $450,000 to build. Um, and when they sell them, generally they sell them around 300,000. So straight off, it's $150,000 loss. Um, and so they would be coming to the town for money. Thank you. Yeah. All right. Discuss invasive plants. So this came up in two ways. One way is I have been working, um, with Molly Corson on the Miles River grant. That's been going on for over a year now. We're we're almost done with that. I'll probably have Molly come in and talk to you guys about what we've been doing there. In this process, we've created the Miles River collaborative. Collaborative. And so right now we have buy in from Beverley Hamilton in Ipswich. To work with us, we got to get together twice a year. We're going to talk about how we're, um, working on climate resiliency and we've got kind of a checklist of things that we want to work on together. And then we're going to start applying for grants together, because when you apply for grants and you're a small town like Wenham, you don't technically tend to get the funding. Um, and it's a lot to apply for these grants takes a lot of time. But if you have, um, a collaboration of four different cities and towns working together, that's how you get the funding. That's how we got the Miles River funding to begin with. So now this is almost done. We've got an action plan ready to go. We've got all towns in cities involved. And so one of the first things that Molly and I were thinking of is mAPK was just the local planning place. Um, is putting out request for proposals. And one of them, Molly and I were thinking about, um, When we looked at the Miles River. It's full of invasives, but it's mostly on residential properties. And so how do we teach residents how to properly care for, you know, their wetlands and in the river? And so we were thinking about going in for money, for education, but then also a pilot program for implementing, um, invasive removal in certain areas. So education and action. Um, so I just wanted to bring that up to you guys. We're going to this is a very beginning stage, um, where I still have to get, um, the rest of the three communities together because this is Molly and I's brainchild. So hopefully they'll all agree to do this together and we'll be able to get some funding for that. And at the same time, Ken came to me about invasive plants and I said, hmm, that's kind of weird. We're thinking about this at the same time. So maybe you'd like to talk a little bit about what you've been saying. 00:51:16,969 S1: Hamilton went on. The Based on your paper contacted you also about the bagpipes. 00:51:22,130 S2: They did, and I'm waiting for that article to come out. Have you seen it yet? Yeah, yeah. Tim Tim is great. Um, sometimes they they get the articles ready, and when they have, like, room in the paper, then they throw them in. So I haven't seen it yet, but, um. Yeah, that's one of his his big things too. 00:51:38,250 S1: Did you mention frag Marisa? Yes. 00:51:40,369 S2: Oh, yeah. 00:51:41,050 S1: About about 15 years ago, the, uh, uh, the entity over in on, uh, on Perkins Row is. It's not a picture of a watershed. It's, uh. Um, Perkins at Perkins rolling in in Hamilton. I mean, in Topsfield. They came to us. They came to us with a with a proposal and an application. The application, in fact, a notice of intent to eliminate Phragmites. Uh, by by, herbicides. Yeah, we granted it. Yeah. Collins did as well. Do you remember it? Yeah. Gordon Collins has done this as well. Gordon College with fragments also. I don't remember that one, but I do remember. I forget the name of it. It's I it's it's like like, uh. It's what you. River. Watershed. It's a river. Uh, and they were over on the Ipswich River and and on Perkins Road. Okay. Yeah. 00:52:46,800 S2: Yeah. That's fantastic. 00:52:47,840 S1: I think so was the Audubon. Audubon? I thought it. Yeah. Yeah. 00:52:53,719 S2: Well, Phragmites also too, when you saw that email that I wrote to Tim. Um, one of the biggest things is fire risk, too, because they go right up in smoke. Um, during droughts. So there's it's not just the environmental risk. There's a public health risk there too. 00:53:08,639 S1: So is there something to jump in here? But is there any town initiative that's going to be going forth on that because the behind that with Hamilton, either one of them Village Improvement Society that he has. 00:53:20,869 S4: Oh. 00:53:21,230 S2: Felt over. 00:53:21,829 S1: There. Because that's where my house told. Yeah. 00:53:24,829 S2: And that used to be. 00:53:26,030 S1: They used to be skating. 00:53:27,030 S2: A skating pond. Yeah. 00:53:28,630 S1: The dam is on my property for. 00:53:30,469 S4: Really? 00:53:31,230 S1: Yes. 00:53:31,670 S4: Yeah. 00:53:32,429 S2: Yeah. I mean, obviously that would be looked at during. 00:53:36,670 S1: Taking it down. My changing character. Who knows what kind of have that. Yeah. 00:53:40,469 S2: Well, you have to rehabilitate it. 00:53:42,269 S1: Are we talking only about stuff in the riparian zone or. You guys all think also thinking about submerged biotic that may be invasive. 00:53:51,949 S2: Honestly, this is so preliminary. Like this is what we have. 00:53:55,949 S1: If it's in the river, it's a non-profit property. That's town property I think. 00:54:05,469 S1: You know, it was my I have a wetsuit. So yeah, it was 2007 or 2006 before the the big recession we had we had uh, we had about three people from the, from, uh, the Army Corps of Engineers with us here, uh, looking at, looking at that, the situation. But then, uh, the recession came and government funding dried up, and then we lost, lost communication with them. 00:54:36,070 S2: It was they were going to dredge the mines River. Right? Yeah. 00:54:39,949 S1: They were going to address the dams, too. There was this there's a dam at myopia. There's a there's a there's a beaver dam that, that, uh, that New England bio labs, that's that's huge. That's huge. And, uh, there was a you find that odd? There's huge beavers at the bio labs. Yeah. Bio lab would have like to get rid of it to to make the the river healthy after the dam, but, uh, but we had a, uh, the chairman of the of the Ipswich Commission. His name was David Stanley. I don't know if he's still around, but he was absolutely against. 00:55:20,260 S2: Taking. 00:55:20,539 S1: Down touching beaver dams. 00:55:24,900 S1: All right. So you'll keep us apprised of as this goes. 00:55:27,460 S4: Forward I will. 00:55:28,420 S2: And Ken, do you want to know the. 00:55:30,219 S1: Reason I got involved with Tim had called me, actually, and she said, you know, we're all talking about what the Conservation Commission is doing about invasives with particular attention to what you call the Australian weed, whatever the name is. But it was basically Frank's. And I said, that's a really good question, because I could not remember, uh, at any time that this commission dealt with that issue. Of course, it may have happened at the time that I was gone. And, you know, the issues that you're talking about with you, that would be interesting. You said, well, you know, can we get together? And I said, well, I'll tell you what, let's go out and take a look at an infestation of frag. And that might help you root you a little bit. And then we can talk about it, and it got me thinking about how it would be prudent for us to have some type of policy, um, put together in case the situation came up again, and maybe even go so far as to encourage removal. If we could come up with a policy that works for everybody. So that's when I went to Kate, and I know Kate, you and Tim, um, discussed this as well. So I think building to some type of policy statement and maybe people would feel more comfortable at this point and say, okay, I'm not going to run in all sorts of problems with the Conservation Commission if I go ripping this stuff out or start pouring herbicide on it, well, we'll herbicide on it, but properly, you know. So I thought it was time to address the issue because it's just a very, very serious issue obviously. 00:56:54,130 S4: Yeah. So, um, in my experience, a lot of the establishments establishment in the first place is always on the edge of the disturbed zone. And where I live, you can actually see it, Um, right behind 60 Main Street, right where the edge of the disturb zone is. There's a stand that's started to grow. So I'm thinking that probably establishing some best practices to ensure vegetation is put in place to prevent frack from taking hold in the first place would be a good way to go. So maybe that's something that, rather than just talk about eradication and talk about ways to prevent it taking hold in the first place. 00:57:37,690 S2: Well, another fantastic comment because, um, Casey Lieberstein, who is our the consultant that I work with the most for these kind of things, he works with the BSc group, and he's pretty much known as the climate resiliency guru in the northeast. He's really almost famous in this area. And he said it will be impossible to get rid of it. But if you plant, like you just said around it, more native species, you can you can keep it back. It's crowded up. And so what you're saying is kind of like. Right on. You don't want to do a ton of chemicals in on all that. You want to kind of get cut it back a little bit and then vegetate the. 00:58:17,920 S1: Right place to start. Okay. So I'm going to recognize the esteemed guest. 00:58:23,320 S11: Raises his hand. Appreciate it. I was just curious. Yeah. With, um, oftentimes with invasive management, the practices are so varied and the outcomes often vary. Are we looking to maybe establish different types, styles in certain areas and like test out the best practices? Or do we already have well-established techniques that we would like to implement these skills approachable to residents? 00:58:51,400 S2: Yeah. And I think that's what we would be studying in this if we get the money is how we want to go about that. Absolutely. It's a good question. 00:58:59,960 S11: Especially with the pairing that you might find more limited to a surface. 00:59:06,670 S1: If I may, also related to this is the policy of applying herbicides within our buffer zone, within our jurisdiction as well. And I know that some regulations out there, but I'm not sure that we have a clear policy on that. Maybe we do. It just hasn't come up since I've been on this commission, maybe some guidance to people in that as well. Uh, people might be more forthcoming to say we're going to get rid of the Japanese knotweed spray if it's, God forbid, roundup, but sometimes, um, but I think it's no longer the carcinogen. 00:59:40,789 S11: According to the Supreme Court today. 00:59:42,670 S1: What's that they can't do? Well, yeah, well, it was an interesting discussion, to say the least. You know, who can you sue? Um, but you know that that kind of policy. Um, we have it on the books. And a ready answer, I think could really help a lot of people. 01:00:00,309 S2: Yeah. And I think one of Molly and I's idea was having some sort of flyer for something that we can have on our website to say, this is what you can do without going to the Conservation Commission. This is what you absolutely can't do without going into conservation. 01:00:14,150 S1: Absolutely. It should. 01:00:14,989 S2: Be. Yeah. Exactly right. Yeah. So that would kind of be more of the educational piece. And then. 01:00:21,110 S1: Right, we're all on the same page. I still think, you know. 01:00:24,030 S11: If. 01:00:24,869 S12: As much as I want to encourage the eradication of public monies, I don't want to see people haphazardly doing it. And so I would feel more comfortable if they there's no blanket exemption to coming to us if they're going to be removing vegetation of any kind within a riparian zone, in my opinion. 01:00:41,550 S1: Um, Mister chairman, without. 01:00:43,989 S11: Without. 01:00:45,429 S1: Without having to pay the fee. 01:00:47,670 S12: Yeah, they can do it as an RDA. Um. 01:00:50,550 S1: But Phragmites is a tall plant. Yes it is. And and and I think it's, it's if you're careful to do it a little bit at a time with herbicide. You could do it without bothering other plants. 01:01:06,420 S12: So Gordon did do. Apply herbicide in there. In koi pond. Um. 01:01:15,139 S11: Effective? 01:01:16,500 S12: Yeah, it was effective. There was no. Great. I didn't see any fish kills, but they might have heard, I don't know, but they were doing very targeted application on the stems. Um, I. 01:01:29,420 S1: Were to anticipate that they hired a pro to do that. 01:01:32,219 S12: Yeah. Oh, absolutely. 01:01:33,500 S1: Yeah. 01:01:34,300 S12: Um, and the other thing with the Phragmites is, you know, um, what happens when black people burn it and that's it. Withrow. Um. 01:01:45,820 S1: It makes it healthier. 01:01:46,820 S12: I know it's not a good thing, but. 01:01:48,739 S11: Um. 01:01:49,460 S12: But black plastic, um, over is a way to actually stop the growth from killing. Yeah. Um, once you cut it. So there are less destructive ways to guess to control it potentially. So I think to your question, I think it's going to be very species specific to what is the best mechanism, uh, to control some of these invasives. Japanese knotweed is like horrible. It's almost impossible. Yeah. I mean, you got to dig up the roots. Um, and that's that's not easy. No, but it's no small task. 01:02:29,969 S2: That's an olive garden and left behind when we went on that walk that day. Yeah. 01:02:34,730 S1: Yeah. 01:02:36,250 S12: So. 01:02:37,329 S1: Mr. Chairman, will you entertain a motion? 01:02:40,010 S12: Wait a minute. 01:02:40,849 S2: We got the minutes. 01:03:05,530 S1: Oh, yeah, Temple Street can remember ten Maple Street. We did a side visit there. 01:03:11,369 S2: Yeah I know. I just told them when it's vegetated to let us know, we'll put them back on the agenda. 01:03:25,449 S1: And then if we accept the this is written, I second the motion. All in favor, Ken. All right. Yeah. Yes, Jackie. Yes. Leah. I voted yes as well. I don't have any other matters to do. Any other matters? 01:03:39,690 S2: Nothing. 01:03:41,010 S1: All right. Leo. I'd like to move, Mr. Chairman, that we adjourn. 01:03:47,050 S1: In favor? All right. Yes. Yes. Jackie. Yes. Leo. I vote yes as well.