00:00:00,067	S1:
Now 716 and I will take a motion to call to order the Hamilton Select Board meeting for March 2nd.

00:00:11,167	S2:
So moved.

00:00:12,367	S1:
So we have a motion by Ben. Can I get a second? And we'll do a roll call vote to, uh, to move into our meeting, starting with you. Rosie.

00:00:22,601	S3:
Rosie. Kennedy. Hi.

00:00:23,868	S1:
Uh, Tom.

00:00:25,367	S4:
Tom. On our side. Uh, Ben.

00:00:27,400	S1:
Ben Glatzer and Bill Wilson. I, uh, so to try to catch up a little bit. There are a ton of board open openings and committees. I encourage everyone to read through those. Uh, and if you have the time to, to get involved. Um, we do have one item on the consent agenda. It's an approval from the Little League, uh, for some sponsorship banners to be hung around the fields at Patton Park. Uh, so can I take a motion to approve the consent agenda?

00:00:57,267	S2:
So moved.

00:00:58,701	S1:
Okay, we have a motion by Ben a second. Second. Second by Rosie. Any further discussion or reasons why we might not want to consent this one?

00:01:11,100	S3:
Or is it talking about putting the banners along the fencing? Is that what? I understand it to be much the same as they do over at Pingree Park.

00:01:22,801	S5:
Yes, and really much the same that you've been doing here for the last 3 or 4 years. If you have questions, Sean Timmons of the recreation Department is on zoom and can answer questions. But this is something the board's been doing for the last 3 or 4 years, at least.

00:01:35,567	S1:
Yeah, I think there might be some on the dugouts as well. And some fencing. I think there's more fencing along Pingree than there would be, uh, be here, but it's consistent with prior practice.

00:01:45,367	S4:
Yeah.

00:01:46,000	S1:
All right. So I'll take a roll call, vote to approve the consent agenda. Rosie.

00:01:53,501	S3:
Rosie Kennedy I.

00:01:54,667	S1:
Tom.

00:01:57,300	S4:
Myers.

00:01:58,100	S1:
Ben.

00:01:58,567	S4:
Ben Kaluza I.

00:01:59,400	S1:
And Bill Wilson I. So that approves is approved unanimously. Uh. Public comment. This is a time where anybody can get up in, uh, speak for no more than three minutes on any topic.

00:02:11,667	S6:
Any public comment.

00:02:14,100	S1:
We do have time later for the stretch code and other items like that, so there'll be ample opportunity there. But you are welcome for this time as well.

00:02:22,000	S7:
If you want comments on that at the time of the that discussion, or do you want them now, do you want.

00:02:29,300	S1:
It can come either way. I mean, if there's some general wants to speak, happy to entertain them now, but we'll entertain them then as well.

00:02:35,467	S7:
That doesn't matter.

00:02:36,767	S1:
It's been a practice, right? We're voting. No. No.

00:02:40,501	S5:
You can't allow it now. It's just that.

00:02:43,000	S4:
But it's okay. Um.

00:02:47,267	S6:
I just want to ask you a quick question. So, um, you got this poster from me? Did everyone.

00:02:53,467	S1:
Came? Yes we did. Thank you.

00:02:54,801	S6:
And then this the Mickey put together.

00:02:57,567	S1:
Yeah, we have that right here as well. A lot of good information. I know we had a long discussion, um, last week, but we got a lot of good information from from several people, so thank you for that.

00:03:08,601	S6:
All right. Well thank you. I'm Jeanie Moran at 21 Garfield Avenue. And we appreciate the time that you folks are taking to listen to Hamilton Environmental Impact Committee and our, um, our work done to promote the specialized code, which if passed tonight, we'll get on the warrant. We'll then go to town meeting, and folks will have the chance to vote on that. And, um, if that's affirmative, then we go forward to work on climate leader status. Um, we also have planned, um, three meetings, uh, to help educate both Hamilton and one of voters. Uh, this is already on the Wenham town warrant. And so this one's called what is the specialized stretch building code, and the one that HTC is sponsoring is Thursday, March 5th from 6 to 7. The Hamilton Library large meeting room and we will have some folks from the Dia. We are, uh, Dillon Patel will be joining us for that to answer people's questions. And of course, that's what we want to hear and we want to explain it, but also answer people's questions. And we might have some people joining us on zoom tonight as well, too. And we do have some folks here to help support us. I just want to point out, Kim Strobing is here from Hamilton Environmental Environmental Impact Committee. Um, and Jack Whittier, uh, Emmet has just recently stepped off the committee, but he is still supporting us 100%. So we are grateful for that. And we also want to mention that we have Bob Knowles, um, Heather Ryan, um, other folks here in support of going forward as climate leaders for both communities. Thank you.

00:04:57,667	S4:
Thank you. Thank you.

00:05:00,801	S1:
Any other public comments at this time?

00:05:07,000	S8:
Good evening.

00:05:08,367	S4:
Good evening. It's nice to be here. I'm Jack Whittier. 35 Field Road, Hamilton. Um, I'm the newcomer to the environmental Impact Committee, and I'm going to keep it really brief. I'm basically benefiting from the work that everybody has done before me. And, uh, just I think it's really well teed up for the, the, the, the specialized code, um, and the way it's teed up for subsequent work through the town. Um, the climate leader status, uh, allows us to do things that are really great for the town and from my perspective, taxpayer and controlling energy costs going forward, both for residents as well as for the school district. So look forward to the discussion. All right. Thank you.

00:05:51,767	S1:
Thank you. Jack.

00:06:03,567	S9:
Emmett Holt to Mayor Hill road. Glad to be back. Thank you very much.

00:06:07,868	S1:
Thank you.

00:06:08,367	S9:
Um, did you guys all get the one pager that you were asked for?

00:06:12,267	S1:
We did.

00:06:13,000	S10:
Yeah. Okay, great.

00:06:14,567	S9:
So what I really wanted to do, you've. I've spoke enough about, um, this energy code, but it's more important. The other item that's on the agenda tonight, which is the new school roof, because really, the motivation for me personally as a taxpayer in the town and saving costs and all that is, you know, number one, taking care of our kids by putting a roof over their head and insulating the school better. And then number two, by energizing that roof, because I agree with Rosie 100% that, you know, National Grid is taking us to the cleaners, and we need to go back and collect $1 million of grant funding through them. And also, it's the we're going to if we put rooftop solar, we're going to save about $200 a year off of the tax bill for that cost. We then have free energy. That $200, if you just take half of it. For Hamilton, that comes out to about $36 a year out of my taxes. So $1 million one time, I think I calculated with the help of ChatGPT, is about 325 bucks that I get to save. And then another, uh, 30 some odd dollars a year that both Hamilton and Windham people save. So I just really want to point out that it's not just about the stretch code. That's a really small thing. There's only five new houses a year that get built that. And I did want to hand out one more thing, and I wanted to thank.

00:07:49,667	S5:
You as well. We do have that.

00:07:50,701	S9:
Appreciate it. We got that. Okay. Those are all the five houses, what they had and all of that. You know, I sat down with Rich and Dennis and Marianne, who did a great job. Three different visits to them to. Those are their estimates of kind of what it's going to cost to upgrade those houses. The fact of the matter is, it's paid back in the first, uh, you know, 8 to 10 years of the 30 year mortgage. And then from that they're on it's free electricity after that. The cheapest answer for going forward, affordability is a huge, huge issue. And housing construction and the cheapest thing for the homeowners to go with the all electric house going forward with all of the credits and all that. So you're really doing a favor. Most people are just out of habit, want to have gas and all that. They can still do have the gas. But my question is, are you putting air conditioning in the house if you're then is that air conditioning? You know, heat pump, air conditioning. Then you're already doing the ducting and all that kind of stuff. And you have a hybrid house already for heating, so it's going to be cheaper. So I just hope all you guys were asking is let the voters decide.

00:09:03,167	S10:
That's really what the question is tonight.

00:09:05,767	S9:
Thank you.

00:09:06,267	S1:
Okay, I appreciate it.

00:09:13,467	S10:
Yeah.

00:09:18,667	S7:
Hi.

00:09:19,167	S1:
Hi.

00:09:20,567	S11:
Deb Safford, Maple street. Um, so I just wanted to talk about the stretch code. Also, I know that it's going to be up later, but, um, one of the things that my dad taught me when I was little, when we went to an ATM machine is, you know, we went up and we saw this money pop out and it was like, wow, the machine's giving us money. And he's like, no, it's the money I put in and I'm pulling out. The machine doesn't make money. And I bring that up because it's that concept of energy and electricity and how if we put something, you know, plug something in, it's kind of free and there's no consequence. But every time we plug something in, the energy is being created somewhere else. There's a consequence somewhere else. So the stretch energy code to me is a binding response to a non-binding resolution. So we're going to bind our residence for any kind of construction, any kind of renovation. We're binding them to doing something for a non-binding resolution in the town which is burdening everybody. It's different when you're trying to vote as a community for putting solar panels on top of the roof of the school. Like, that's a great discussion. Like, let's have that. But to make to have the community vote for everybody for whatever happens to their renovations, I think is, is is a complete overburdening of our population, The power grid is very old. It's vulnerable to attack. It's overly burdened. AI we know it's just sucking up all the energy we just had. Rolling brownouts and power outages for hours, 15 hours or something in Hamilton. Maybe longer. For others, the storm can shut it down. If people don't have other alternative sources of energy and heat, we're going to lose our residents. I mean, we had residents on my street who were, um, ill because their house was so cold. Right? And so if we have everything on one kind of format, which is very old and decrepit and very vulnerable, I think that that's going to become a risk. And the requirements also can change whatever the requirements are, that can change that the states will and that we have to keep doing it. It's very burdensome to the building person. It's very burdensome to the residents. You know, why? Why would we do this? And actually all these reasons are why Essex revoked it. So I would.

00:11:40,467	S5:
Um, clarification.

00:11:42,400	S10:
Okay.

00:11:42,901	S5:
It's a specialized stretch. So they chose not to adopt stretch code and lost their green community status over it, but had a conversation with the town administrator, and I'd heard that was mentioned a couple of times, specifically called Essex to find out what happened there. And the time administrator there assured me that they they never had the scratch code and that they lost their green community status because of it. But they that was they didn't vote it in and then voted out.

00:12:07,100	S11:
So it seemed like they had voted something that they were voting out, but whatever. So they they understood that there was a burden to the community and risk. And I think that the label of having, you know, green statuses is lovely, but it's really done so that we can have the possibility of future grants. And, you know, in the spirit of the emperor has no clothes. You know, our state has no money. And so to to burden and handcuff our residents for something, for the hope of having some future money As a as a town edict, I think is is doing a complete disservice to our community. Let the residents do it if they want to do it like I have no problem if you want to do it free will, but to to make it an edict going forward and to bind us for this way, as opposed to encouraging people to make these decisions, I think it would be a much better strategy. So I'm really asking you guys, you know, and I love my I love the Earth, I love the planet. I'm not I'm not a hater. I love our trees. Our trees actually need the carbon. You know, our trees need carbon. We need the oxygen from them. So there's a whole ecosystem I love it. I wasn't in favor of the fields. You know, I'm. I'm not crazy. I just think to to make an edict for our residents is a burden that you guys can just stop and prevent. So I'm asking you to say no, to not put it, to not be in favor of it. I mean, maybe it's already on the warrant, but I'd ask you to not be in favor of it because we need to advocate. There's so many controversial things at this time. Meeting coming up, people are going to have, you know, in terms of overrides and, you know, people are going to be thinking about their pocket. And I think this is another cost that's going to be unclear, people. It's a hard thing to have to read and figure out. So I'm really asking you to vote no on that and be gatekeepers for our taxpayers. Thank you.

00:14:00,067	S1:
Okay.

00:14:02,400	S1:
So I'll remind everyone this is public comment. We will have a larger discussion on this topic during our regular agenda item.

00:14:10,167	S7:
Thanks.

00:14:10,801	S1:
You're welcome.

00:14:11,801	S11:
Uh, Beth, Herr.

00:14:12,701	S12:
Asbury Street, um, I actually talked to the select chairman from Essex, who and I watched the video where they did repeal from the stretch Co they never had the specialized stretch Ko but they had the stretch code and then they repealed it back to the basic code because there was no more money that they could get from the state, and they found it very burdensome. So I. If you did not watch the eight minutes, there were two sections with a little less than four minutes each. I would actually even encourage you to do that tonight while people are here, if you haven't had a chance, because it was very enlightening as to why they decided to repeal the stretch code. Um, it doesn't just apply to new houses. I heard five new houses. It doesn't just apply to new houses. Um, I spent a lot of time today. Um, in December of 2022, National Grid reached out to Essex, probably to Hamilton as well, and said that they had a plan for rolling blackouts and brownouts. They needed to have a plan because they were concerned about the winter. And um, and we actually by 2035, we're not supposed to be able to get new, um, gas cars. It's only going to be electric. So there is a pressure on the grid. And again, if people want to do it, great. But the pressure on the grid and all these new mandates, I don't think I'm meshing. And I happen to find myself at Mystic Power Plant in 2020 for May of 2024, when they were closing. They were the most effective and the the most efficient and largest power plant on the eastern seaboard is what I was told by the people there. And they told me, I asked them about all these mandates coming out of the state, and why would we ever be shutting down an electric power plant at this point when we're trying to move forward? And they just looked at me with the same questions that I had. They were like, we don't understand it either. So a couple things. So the underlying metrics of the code can change. In fact, that has changed with the stretch code, um, that that we are currently under. So it's as if you have given the bank authorization to take money out of your account, and when you vote on it, you said you can take money out of my account and you're going to take it out once a year for $100. But we are not just authorizing that. We are authorizing them to take out money whenever they want for however much they want, because we do not control the underlying metrics. That is very concerning to me, because they can keep ratcheting up what the expectations are. Um, I also think it's discriminatory. And the fact that I think for some people may want to put an addition on their house to have an elderly parent live with them, and it would be a cost burden. Not everybody has that money up front. They may not have a mortgage. Um, and then also there was in April of 2023, um, there was a regional meeting. And one of the things on there was talking about how to help businesses with the potential, um, Instability of electricity. That was a regional meeting. And Joe, I think was part of that. I saw I think I saw your name on that email as well. So there's real concerns. It's not just making it up. I'm not just making up. There's concerns about the grid. And I'm very concerned about us moving forward with this as is. I think we need more information. We shouldn't be educating after it's on the warrant. It should be educating before it's on the warrant. Because especially with other things on the warrant, we want to make sure that when people vote, they know what they're voting for. And I spent hours today and I just hit the surface. And I had been aware of this last year. So thank you for your time.

00:18:08,767	S1:
Appreciate it. Anything online? Anything. Anybody else in the room again? We'll, uh, when we moved, when we get to the Warren articles, uh, you know, this is on there as well for further discussion for the board. Um, okay, let's go to our next topic. It's a public hearing for a utility pole on black Brook road. Um, as per our responsibilities, anytime a pole goes up, we have a public hearing. We allow our buttars to comment. I know we have a representative from National Grid here. If we have any questions. It seems very straightforward to me. We have some pictures here of identifying where the pole would go, and a brief ride up that was in your packet. Thank you for joining us. Um, is there anything you'd like to say up front or. Uh.

00:18:57,567	S13:
Hello. My name is John Jenkins. Uh, I'm representing National Grid. I'm a design engineer in the Beverly office. Um, currently, the two poles, uh, 21, 96 and 21, 97, um, black Brook road have a 230 foot span between them. And for our standard, we keep it to 150 now. So adding this new pole in the middle, um, approximately 130ft from poll 2197. We'll just decrease the tension on the wires out there and make it safer.

00:19:42,167	S1:
That makes sense. So this is a standard with National Grid. Are there other polls that we are aware of in the town of Hamilton that we might want to go back and release tension on as well?

00:19:52,267	S13:
Um.

00:19:53,467	S1:
I know that's not for this public. I'm just curious if there's like a road map of this that we may have another ten, 15 or none.

00:19:59,667	S13:
Yeah, we I mean, we have our maps with everything, but the best way is just to catch it on the field and notice it.

00:20:08,467	S1:
There's no additional wires going up. It's just just to kind of relieve some tension.

00:20:12,767	S13:
Just. Yeah, this poll is going to be going in the middle of the already existing infrastructure. And it will uh, we're replacing some of the wire on one side just okay.

00:20:23,467	S1:
And there have been notices to the butters. Yeah. And everyone. No, no.

00:20:28,067	S5:
No issues. Well, we have one of the butters online.

00:20:31,000	S1:
Okay.

00:20:31,767	S5:
So I assume that's what Mr. Alsup is here for.

00:20:36,767	S14:
I'm here for numerous things tonight.

00:20:39,501	S1:
Any comments on the, uh, the pole? Uh, of course. Discussion.

00:20:44,367	S14:
Uh, I've noticed that there was, uh, other markets, um, that are sort of mysteriously placed white with a red top, and they seem to be dividing other areas between long stretches. And so I'm wondering if you if you actually have a comprehensive plan for pole replacement. And there was one pole that was fairly destroyed by a tree, um, that apparently is not being replaced in this particular process, which should be replaced. So I'm wondering where where you might stand on the other other people's.

00:21:23,868	S13:
Um, for the other polls I'm not too sure about. I can check back and see if there's more designs coming, or because I just went out today and marked for this one specifically because this is its own job. Um, I can also come out and check if you do. You know, what is the closest address to that pole that was damaged?

00:21:45,701	S14:
Uh, mine. 1111 Block Road.

00:21:48,701	S13:
Okay, so I didn't go that far down the street today, but I can come out and check. And, uh.

00:21:55,000	S14:
You might notice there are a couple other areas that have similar spans.

00:22:00,467	S13:
Yep. On that street. You mean.

00:22:02,367	S14:
I.

00:22:02,467	S10:
Noticed.

00:22:03,200	S14:
You know, markers being in place? I was just wondering if there's any any planning for that?

00:22:09,868	S13:
Uh, I mean, there could be. I'm not aware of it yet, but, um, I just saw this one coming up and did my research on this one.

00:22:22,868	S14:
Thank you.

00:22:24,968	S13:
And there will be no outages.

00:22:27,000	S14:
Production, by the way. No objection.

00:22:30,367	S1:
Okay. Any other comments from the room from Butters? Potentially online or from the board?

00:22:40,367	S1:
Okay. With with none. I guess I'll entertain a motion to approve the addition of a poll on black Brook road, as identified in this diagram.

00:22:50,901	S2:
Between poll numbers. The 2196 and 2197. I have that right. Yep. Yep. So moved.

00:22:59,868	S1:
Okay, we have a motion. Can I get a second? Okay, we have two motions. We'll do a roll call vote if there's no further discussion. Starting with you, Rosie.

00:23:10,901	S3:
Rosie Kennedy, I Tom.

00:23:13,968	S2:
Tom Myers, I.

00:23:15,100	S1:
Ben.

00:23:15,601	S2:
Ben Kaluza.

00:23:16,267	S1:
I and Bill Wilson. Hi.

00:23:17,701	S10:
We're good. Thank you. Rachel. Good for you.

00:23:25,100	S1:
Okay. Next on our agenda, we have a department head report on water rate adjustments with the director of public works is Tim Olson online? Yes. Okay. Hey, Tim.

00:23:36,767	S10:
How's it going?

00:23:40,267	S10:
Yeah, perfect. Thank you. Yeah.

00:23:43,667	S15:
Thanks. Tim Olson, DPW director, saying a couple of weeks ago, uh, you as well? Uh, certainly not, I guess preliminary discussions to, uh, look at adjustments of the water rates, um, with other, uh, upcoming decisions and potential capital requests, uh, looking at the larger five year plan, and there are some substantial projects, uh, that we should be looking into, and I'm just trying to plan accordingly. Um, with the Wait as it is, it's an enterprise account. As we all know, covered by all the expenses are covered by rates, uh, in the infrastructure charges. Um, so I have taken the time to look into a couple of those items that you had asked me to do. Um, a couple of weeks ago. More importantly, I was asked to look at.

00:24:40,200	S16:
Recordings recording in progress.

00:24:42,767	S15:
Um, the average of a two person household, uh, I was able to generate a list of just under 100, uh, properties in town. Um, variety of ages, a variety of locations. Uh, so I think it's a good sample of, uh, you know, a of a two person household in Hamilton, 100 samples. Uh, averaging them out over the a year period, uh, was just over about 10,000 gallons for a, uh, average for a quarter. Um, so I believe what you had asked me to do is look at the impact of potentially raising that low tier rate, up from 5000 gallons to the 10,000 gallon mark. So I did that, and I did calculate what an average bill would look like. And by adjusting it for 5000 to 10,000, uh, it seemed like it was a savings, uh, per quarter of about $12 and about $50 for the year. So it really doesn't change much, uh, adding, you know, or, uh, adjusting that low tier. Um, I did use 400,000 gallons, which I believe is a fairly good estimate for a household in Hamilton. Uh, what I've seen on record. Um, but I just went through that exercise, uh, as requested. Um, I also pulled, uh, a listing as I was also asked to do. I pulled the listing of our past, um, adjustments, and we did an adjustment back in 2015. I did a new adjustment and or another adjustment in 2020. That was about a 10% increase across the board for each of the five tiers, with a 33% increase to the infrastructure fee. It went from $60 to $80 in 2020 from 20 2020. We kept rates until about 2023, when we did a new rate adjustment in that rate adjustment. Three years later, in 2023, we I was asked to increase rates down the line with the five tiers starting at 30% each year, raising up by 5%. So 30, 35, 40, 45, 50. And we increased the infrastructure fees, uh, about 30% from $80 to one tenth. That is per quarter. Um, and again, that was to cover our, uh, not only our operating expenses, but I was asked to cover the debt service with our infrastructure fee alone. Uh, I think that's a good strategy. Um, I think we are still in line and should look at that as a as a good strategy to continue with. Um, but there is a lot here. Um, there is a lot to absorb, digest. But I think what we're looking at is, like I said earlier, we're looking at increasing increases in our operating as well as some potential, uh, larger capital projects that we should look to plan for in the future. Uh, how we do that, that is kind of why I'm here. And we're looking at this, um, for the now as well as for the future. You know, does it make sense to increase rates to a point that we are able to cover some of those larger expenses with, uh, retained earnings and maybe limit the amount of.

00:28:10,100	S10:
Uh, we.

00:28:10,667	S15:
Need the bonding. Um, but these are.

00:28:14,667	S10:
The.

00:28:15,200	S15:
Projects that are becoming vital and important for Hamilton. Uh, regardless of the, um, future of regionalization or not, these projects are still going to happen because of our current infrastructure.

00:28:32,367	S5:
I'm sorry if I add a little. Add a little to that, too. So, I mean, some of your history with your Water Enterprise Fund, is that the town meetings? Uh, in the early 20 tens, authorized borrowing of up to $10 million to be funded by the enterprise fund. Um, over, over several years. The $10 million was eventually borrowed. Your principal left to pay back on that is about $8.5 million. That's about really eight and a half to $10 million. About the limit of what you want to put against borrowing on the enterprise system that size. So a couple of years ago, as Tim had mentioned, and the Finn had endorsed, we started adjusting that, we adjusted the water rates to try to build up the retained earnings so that some of the smaller projects could be done for cash, cost us less. We wouldn't have to borrow money to pay the cost of borrowing money, and we could get some of that stuff done. But currently, if you look at the Cap five year capital plan, right now, there's about an estimated $11.5 million worth of water projects that need to get done over the next 5 to 8 years. Um, you can't raise enough money by increasing the rates to realistically pay all that through retained earnings, but neither can you pay it all off by adding more to the debt. So I think Tim brings forward a good idea of making a modest adjustment to the rates, to be able to build up the retained earnings after we make votes at this year's time meeting. Wendy. Correct me if I say this wrong. After we make votes at this year's town meeting and maintain 20% of operating as retained earnings. That's part of our financial policies. Uh, we would have about $1.2 million in retained earnings. A water project is going to cost between 2 and $3 million, so at the rate we're currently charging at the rates we're currently charging at the current usage, it would take us probably another two years to raise enough money in retained earnings to be able to do one project. That's not going to really help us in the long run. So the idea would be, again, a modest Tim's giving you a spreadsheet with a couple of different options. You can look at those and ask him to come up with some others. Um, if I share this sheet with you real quick, and the folks at home, you know, on the, uh, the colored, the colored, uh, plots to.

00:30:45,000	S5:
Illustrate four different options. The. Tim just study just to put numbers on and have you look at and some of the things that it's impossible to read these at home. I know that, um, but, you know, um, if you looked at trying to slide.

00:31:00,167	S10:
This.

00:31:01,067	S5:
Over here, um, Tim's in my way to it, but they have, um. If you could look at those options, make this thing eatable. Um, you could say that, you know, one of the plans calls to to increase the infrastructure fee and increase the rates. One plan costs cost to not increase the infrastructure fee and increase the rates more or less. There's different options. So you could ask them to study other options that you think might be, you know, between what these options are here, but it gives you some kind of parameters. If you look at the spreadsheets, you should have the spreadsheets already. I can't figure out how to get to this.

00:31:43,767	S1:
Yeah, I remember we went over.

00:31:44,767	S10:
There was a question.

00:31:46,300	S1:
Yeah. Go ahead.

00:31:46,868	S2:
Ben. Um, with the infrastructure fee, uh, is that a a flat fee? That all. All. Yeah. Users pay.

00:31:56,267	S5:
Yeah. That was added to the bills probably 5 or 6 years ago now. Okay.

00:32:00,767	S1:
It's a flat fee, not a percent of.

00:32:02,267	S10:
Your.

00:32:02,367	S5:
Flat fee. Every every ratepayer pays the same infrastructure every quarter. Yeah. And, um, you know.

00:32:09,267	S2:
That was part.

00:32:10,167	S10:
Of.

00:32:10,267	S5:
That was a big part of the way to try to raise the, uh, retained earnings because the idea was being infrastructure benefits every every user in the system, not how much you use it. Every user needs their infrastructure to be improved. So and.

00:32:22,767	S2:
We have a little over $1 million in retained earnings in that infrastructure.

00:32:28,100	S5:
In the.

00:32:29,067	S2:
Enterprise fund. Okay. And what I know we went through the last week on there was a big list of funds. But what are we learning on that?

00:32:39,267	S5:
Yeah. The enterprise fund is is different. It doesn't operate with the. Are we allowed to invest the I don't I'm not sure if we're allowed to invest the residual in the in the enterprise fund. It's not uh, it doesn't work the same as other funds.

00:32:50,968	S2:
Okay.

00:32:51,601	S10:
Correct. No.

00:32:54,801	S5:
It's the it's essentially the general fund for the water department.

00:32:58,567	S2:
Okay.

00:32:59,467	S1:
So that sits in a basic savings account collecting.

00:33:02,601	S5:
Little we can do with.

00:33:03,300	S2:
It. There's no way to to CDs or anything even.

00:33:07,467	S15:
And I think as, as, um, as Joe mentioned earlier, the problem that we were having is we're, you know, we're forecasting out a certain amount of, of revenue, uh, to not only cover the current expenses and operating, but also planning for capital. I think with, uh, you know, current market, current rates, everything, it's just not able to keep up with it. So we can it could be two years. We could look at planning for two years. But then with the world or whatever happens, we're not able to to generate the money that we're thinking of or the price of, uh, phase five or phase six of our water, water operation or water infrastructure project may just. We're adding what? We're not gaining. Uh, if that makes any sense. It's just, um, a lot of this work is very expensive. Um, but unfortunately needs to continue and needs to get done just because of our aging infrastructure. Um.

00:34:08,267	S1:
All right. So, um.

00:34:09,868	S15:
I think we should be looking at nearly and I know we continue to say that, and it's, uh, but I think that's very important these days just because of the, um, well, quality in the market.

00:34:22,367	S5:
We've been doing it about every other year at this point, and it's been maybe two years now, uh, since the last time we made an adjustment. Tim. Is that right?

00:34:30,100	S10:
Uh.

00:34:30,667	S15:
It was 20, 23 three.

00:34:32,000	S2:
Yeah.

00:34:32,367	S5:
So it's longer. So it's kind of looking like it might be time to make a look ahead and make an adjustment. Uh, as I said, these these. If the board could take a look at the different options that were provided, make suggestions on things that you'd like to see, change it up a little different. Tim can bring that back. And then, um, we'd like to be able to have lots of runway to be able to make sure the public knows what's coming. We don't we don't want this to affect anybody. Until what, Tim? The August bill. But we want to have time between now and then. That happens to be able to, um, you know, educate and inform the community about what's going on and why. So we're hoping that maybe either at the next meeting in March or the first meeting April, you'll be able to consider what you want to do with the water rates and make a vote so that we have time to run it.

00:35:15,100	S1:
So with these, I see these grids. I don't have it in front of me tonight, but I remember you walking us through them. Tim. Has anything changed since that last meeting? Did you adjust any of the gallons that we started talking about, or. This is the same grid because it was a minimal impact?

00:35:28,567	S15:
Yeah, yeah, it's the same that I had before. Um, I mean, I can do a variety of different scenarios. Um, it really all bottoms down to how much we want to, you know, try to, um, generate not only covering the operating expenses but also building and planning for future.

00:35:47,701	S1:
Yeah, that's kind of what I wanted to just touch on, because what I heard you say, Joe, is, you know, we've got about 8.5 million that we're still paying from prior projects, right? And I think you you mentioned an 11.5 million of future over the next five years. Does that get us to gaming, like you said, and where we want to be is at the total nut, if you will, 20 ish million over the last five and future five. Or is this an ongoing, you know, kind of phase of another 10 million every five years?

00:36:15,868	S15:
Yeah.

00:36:16,267	S10:
So, I mean.

00:36:17,300	S15:
I think a little bit of both there because one of the projects is, uh, replacing the, uh, the water tank upon Brownsville. Um, that is a tank that I think the first there's four cells up there. The first cell is 1935. Um, I think the last of the four was 1957. So it's an underground water tank. Um, that is, um, you know.

00:36:43,000	S10:
It's it's.

00:36:43,868	S15:
It's at the end of its life, uh, and it's a very vital piece of our infrastructure. And we don't have redundancy. We don't have a backup plan. Um, that is something that I believe, you know, we do. We commit to it. That is a that's something that would be there for the next, you know, 57,500 years, whatever it is. Uh, you know, that's a, um, that's kind of a one and done, I guess, is what I'm getting in. And I think the other projects that I'm looking at is that the infrastructure upgrades, that is unfortunately, that is a piece of something that needs to continue to happen. Um, and we're not alone. Every other we have these numerous conversations out of my conferences, at my seminars about how costly the infrastructure is. Um, you know, we are fortunate we don't have, uh, sewer in town. Uh, that is really driving a lot of communities. Um, costs, um, skyrocketing. Uh, we have water. I think if we plan correctly, I think we can really make some really big strides with upgrading our water system here. Um, the $10 million, for example, the $10 million that you'll refer to earlier that brought us through four phases of water system improvements, as well as a large, um, uh, upgrade at our water plant. So that was, you know, roughly 60,000ft of new water pipe, uh, as part of those four phases. And like I said, on the substantial upgrade so that, you know, that was from 2012 to 2018, I believe it was when we that that money was, uh, was utilized. Um, you know, things have changed. The market has changed since that point, unfortunately. But, uh, we can do some substantial work with, uh, with, you know, given given the funding in place. Um, so there's work to be done. But like I said, I think some projects are are one and done and other projects are continuation. Uh, and, you know, building infrastructure that would be well needed and well used, uh, you know, for the long term, short term, as well as long term.

00:38:55,267	S1:
Okay. Tom?

00:38:57,767	S15:
Yeah. Um, just a couple of questions and comments. Um, Joe, I think you sort of answered that part of my question. I think you have heard you say you want to put the next meeting or two as far as timeline, getting this moving along. And just remind me, this is just you go to the select board and does the town meeting or does go to town meeting.

00:39:14,000	S5:
No, it's a vote for the board. In the town of Hamilton is the Water Commissioners. So you make the you set the rates.

00:39:20,467	S15:
Um, are you planning any sort of, like, broader picture communication around this? I mean, we're town meeting in April. We're looking at a debt exclusion and an override bid cost the taxpayers, you know, another cost of increasing the water cost here, I think I think there needs to be sort of.

00:39:38,167	S10:
A big picture of why we're doing all of this.

00:39:40,868	S15:
But I support.

00:39:42,167	S10:
One.

00:39:42,467	S15:
Thing. I think.

00:39:43,100	S10:
There's a need to.

00:39:44,868	S15:
Support our infrastructure around whether or not I understand what you couldn't put together as far as the proposals and how to do some reasonable resources there. I just think we need some kind of bigger picture of how these things together and other costs. And then we're asking these other folks, and I can see where folks are going to get pretty frustrated. So I think we need to, you know, really communicate this well.

00:40:06,901	S5:
So I think.

00:40:07,467	S2:
In.

00:40:07,667	S5:
2019, Tim, we did a big water meeting. Uh, we had it out at the uh, uh, post and we had public in and we answered questions from folks in the Capcom folks on the fin com others. We had probably 50 people in the room. We went through the water, uh, department study that had been done. We could do another project like that. We want to be able to talk about it in terms of both. What is coming in terms of any rate increases that the board approves and what is needed going forward and and why. And we could probably by then if we if we focus on maybe May or June, I should be able to we should be able to provide some update to on on what's what's working with the North Shore Water Resiliency task force. And what is, you know, kind of more back burner stuff with them. So, um, I think May and June will be a good time to have a big meeting on that. And we can ask, uh, H.W. Canada to tape it for us and kind of keep it on a loop so people can catch it.

00:41:03,801	S15:
Yeah, I think that'd be great. I'd love to participate in that.

00:41:06,000	S1:
And you don't think we want to do a report at this town meeting too soon to kind of just kind of highlight what's coming or we're talking a lot about costs. Like Tom said, that's coming through the schools, through our own town.

00:41:18,367	S5:
We'll do whatever the board wants.

00:41:19,367	S2:
Us.

00:41:19,467	S1:
To do. No, I mean, just throwing.

00:41:20,567	S2:
It out there.

00:41:21,367	S1:
I do.

00:41:21,567	S15:
Think.

00:41:22,267	S2:
I'm just.

00:41:22,667	S5:
Meeting on this.

00:41:23,167	S2:
Here.

00:41:23,367	S1:
So, I mean, it's big. I kind of and I don't know if it's right. And I just want to identify the strategy a little bit better and understand. So we got we know we need about 11 million. You know you want to get you know build up retained earnings to help pay for that through rates. But there's going to be a need to go for borrowing as well. Like do you kind of have that strategy of the mix and timing and prioritization of projects that say, you know, rates will cover XYZ and then we go to borrowing.

00:41:46,901	S5:
I think Wendy, the, uh. Correct me if I'm wrong. Original 10 million and borrowing for the enterprise bond. I think we'd got principal left of about 8.5 million. So over the course of a few years, we paid down about a million and a half. I'd like to see that come down a little bit more before we, you know, attempted to do anything else through borrowing on the enterprise fund right now. But, um, like I said, it's 11.5 million over several years. If we could build up the retained earnings to do another water project or two over the next 5 to 6 years for the retained earnings, that would maybe, hopefully, potentially, um, allow us to borrow to do the water, uh, the water, uh, tank because, um, that's going to be a three and a half to $4 million project. That probably is the size of the project you want to borrow for.

00:42:30,767	S1:
And how many years are left in the eight and a half? Do we know when some.

00:42:33,501	S2:
Of it rolls.

00:42:34,000	S5:
Off in 29 and some of it doesn't come off till 35?

00:42:36,501	S1:
So you've got a roll forward of that. Okay.

00:42:39,067	S17:
The majority is 35. Correct.

00:42:41,868	S1:
Okay. Well, I think we need a blend of arrayed. I think that the board can go through the recommendations. We can come up with any suggestions. You know, the last question I would have to comparatively, how do we look against other communities and with our current rates? And then where would that change us potentially? You know, if we kind of went with any of your recommendations from what range to what from a competitiveness or.

00:43:03,868	S15:
Tim.

00:43:04,100	S5:
Have you had a chance to get the comps?

00:43:07,567	S15:
Yeah, I got to look at it. And it's it's a little challenging because sometimes some communities, uh, budget a certain way. Um, you know, similar to what we're talking about. So rates. Um, what I can um, I guess what I can relate to was when I was in Rockport, um, we have sewer up there, but I broke down my water bill in Rockport. I used about 12,000, just under 13,000 gallons in 2024. Uh, so a couple of years ago, in my water bill was 199 bucks. So that is right where we are today. So two years ago, a year and a half ago, uh, Rockport were where we're kind of going, um, where we're at. So I feel like we're very competitive. Um, like I said, it's very challenging comparing rates because they handle it differently. They they volumes. They either go by cubic feet per second or gallons. Um, and you don't know how some are doing the infrastructure fees, some are doing all just rates. Um, it's kind of hard to compare. Um, but looking at just the actual usage itself, uh, I feel like we're very competitive. Um, you know, and have room to, to increase if we need to. Um, I could I just wanted to point out if we don't increase what I need, correct me if I'm wrong. Um, if we don't increase for next year, we will be in the deficit. Um, based on our operating and capital budget.

00:44:39,767	S1:
So do we know the increase required just to not go in deficit versus increase in retained earnings?

00:44:46,167	S15:
Well I can figure that out. Um, you know, we're very close next year. But there we are in the deficit. So it would it would be a very, very minimal increase. Um okay. To zero out. Um, but but right now, that's what it looks like. Uh, obviously a meeting projections, um, based on quarterly commitments. Um, but it's on our operating capital. Uh, we are flirting with, uh, uh, a small deficit.

00:45:16,501	S1:
Got it. Ben.

00:45:17,767	S2:
How big are the tanks up on Brown's Hill?

00:45:21,667	S15:
There's four of them. They range in size, but there's about, uh, totals about 850,000 gallons.

00:45:28,868	S15:
And they're all below. Great. They're all in.

00:45:32,400	S2:
And are they piped together or are they, um. So you can't isolate any one cell if one can isolate.

00:45:42,100	S15:
I mean, I'm not sure how. Um, the if there are overflow pipes that connect the four together. Um, they all operate at the same elevation. Okay. Uh, there's one pipe in and one pipe out. There's there's not a, um, you know, it's an in and out. Okay? There's no in and out. It's the same pipe. So it operates. Usually we run off the tank when the plant is offline or or off for the night.

00:46:09,567	S2:
Um, I'll ask the question a little differently. If one tank fails, do we? Like, if one of the cells fails, do we lose the other three as well?

00:46:18,367	S15:
Uh, yeah. They all run off the same, uh, elevation.

00:46:22,300	S1:
So the the money that we're talking about though, Tim, that's redundancy and quality. Nothing to do with volume. Right.

00:46:29,801	S15:
Uh, it would be a little larger tank. Um, but it would be new. And obviously there's that, um, stability and and incompetence is in the tank. And it's also it would be partially, um, uh, below and above ground, uh, to gain some pressure and, but also some volume, um, for fire flow protection.

00:46:51,400	S9:
Got it.

00:46:53,400	S15:
I actually have, uh, uh, the late Dave Thompson put together a plan, uh, several years ago for $30,000 study, uh, up at the top of the seminary. Um, I have engaged, uh, an engineer to look at that area to conceptually design a tank. Uh, so I will have more information for you in the future. Um, but we do have some funding and set aside for that, uh, looking at size, looking at location, looking at, uh, conceptual, uh, cost estimates. Um, so there's more coming on that. And that's why I have it on the plan. Uh, on the capital plan, but also as kind of like just an earmark at this point, um, to tighten up that number as we get there.

00:47:41,801	S1:
Any other comments? Questions from the board? Rosie.

00:47:47,567	S18:
Go ahead.

00:47:48,868	S3:
Couple comments. Okay.

00:47:52,167	S19:
Can you hear me?

00:47:52,767	S1:
Yeah. We can. Rosie.

00:47:54,100	S3:
Okay. Sorry, sir. No worries. So the first comment that I have, um. I think it would be very prudent thing to do to put an info sheet about potential, um, water, uh, water rate raises. Uh, I think that's the place to to start the conversation. Um, I do, I, I do like the idea of, um, prospectively growing the retained earnings so that there's less need to borrow. I think people can understand the importance of, um, saving ahead of time. Uh, I think that's a very financially prudent way to do it. Um, I think as well as the info sheet that just talks about sort of generally why? Uh, generally that we're going to need to raise or I think there should be, um, some discussion about what the creative uses are. I think the fact that we need our water tank replaced, I think some information. How old is it, what kind of repairs have been done? I think people would would understand that and, um, be more willing to, uh, not be so upset about, uh, rate raises if they can understand the concrete use that we would have for it.

00:49:11,868	S5:
Rosie, you want that for the next meeting or for are you talking about for, like, the distributed annual town meeting or both?

00:49:19,367	S3:
Oh, well, I think about the intro sheet going going into the water bill. I think that's a very important topic and as many specifics as, um, Tim would be able to put into it. I mean, it piques my interest when I hear specifically, there's an expensive project coming along. I know that Tim has talked to us about the water tank, but I think more specifics. How old is it? What kind of repairs? Um, and, and I think people can relate to the necessity of that more easily than just sort of a nebulous, oh, well, you know, infrastructure. Well, what does that mean? Right. So I, uh, those are thoughts that I had because I know that Tim, um, really works to keep the rates as low as possible. And I think the scenarios that he has suggested to us are varying. And I think that, um, 1 or 2 can certainly work. So I have a lot of faith in Tim, and I think he is very diligent and very careful about, um, water rates. So I think the more people know, the better.

00:50:31,067	S5:
Thanks for the suggestion. We'll do that. We'll get on that.

00:50:33,067	S1:
Yeah. And it's likely probably a future board meeting discussion prior to anything like that going out. I mean, I don't think we've sat and talked about the 11.5 million in the timing and all the good questions, you know. Yep. Um, and that and again, that doesn't even address the volume. I'd love to talk about that. Like what? What else might we incur over time, you know, relative to addressing our, our water needs, not just the quality and the redundancy we're talking about. Yeah. You get a little volume, but, um, I think water is going to be one of our biggest line items going forward. So I think it's probably worth a holistic discussion on all those projects and how we're going to source it, meaning funding wise. And we've got a strategy to increase retained earnings. To Rosie's point, I think people will understand that, you know, and then what's our strategy? We're going to let our debt get down to 6 or 7 million and then we're going to replenish, you know, take on other phases of projects that total this and this is what you get for it. And then our debt will likely go back up to the 10 million or so, probably, if that's kind of your running that number.

00:51:33,167	S3:
And I think, um, another point, um, to, to discuss is the fact that for so many decades, we did absolutely nothing to upgrade our, our water system. I mean, the water system and the infrastructure. And there was a lot of very good conversation about that. And although the $10 million price tag was astronomical, I think when you talk about specifics, people are and and they can see the value as it relates to, to them as taxpayers. I think it's a much more positive conversation.

00:52:11,367	S1:
Tim, you mentioned some studies and such. Do we need any larger scale study to look at this holistically, or do we have what we need to kind of assess and plan for projects and funding?

00:52:23,767	S15:
Um, I mean, all that kind of Wendy and Joe come in on this if they want to, but I know we have talked about these things in my conferences. There are groups out there that will look at, uh, from a like a third party approach outside town looking in, uh, look, trying to create like a water rate study, um, looking at our capital, looking at our planned future expenses, looking at our operating expenses. Uh, there are groups out there. There are companies that do that type of work. Um, I, I tend to, you know, I would probably sign on trying to get a professional in here. And the only reason why I'm saying is because we're dealing with not only a couple, you know, $100,000. We're dealing with multi million dollars. Um, I think it's something that I know I don't have, uh, be honest with you. I don't have the expertise on the water rate study. Um, I can put rates together to cover expenses, but project projecting costs and market and things like that. On some of these larger projects are very important to do that. Um, and do so. Um, there's strategy. There's also the, you know, accuracy. Um, and I think at least having somebody that has that knowledge and that experience. Um, it might not be a bad idea for, you know, for a fraction of the cost.

00:53:48,267	S5:
So, so will you ask them specifically about whether we have a good handle on our system as it is and what this needs are for the future as well? Yes. So the 2019 study that we had Dewberry do provided that and laid out a map for the next, you know, ten plus years for what the town should be looking to try to get accomplished. So all the things that are on the five year capital plan came out of the study in 2019.

00:54:11,767	S1:
So you feel that that plan is your roadmap that you're working on right now that will define ten and 11.5 or whatever?

00:54:17,667	S5:
Yeah, it's the roadmap we're working on right now. We do need to kind of revisit some of the numbers. Uh, as Tim said after Covid, after Covid rates went up across the board. So we have to we have to look at some of the estimates that were put together, reassess those, see if we need to make adjustments. I do think that Tim is right on the water rate stuff. It might be worth it at some point to bring in an outsider to kind of study our water rates and give us some idea. I don't know that we have to do that before we make this change, but we should certainly endeavor to do it before we make a future change.

00:54:49,567	S1:
Okay. Well, so thanks for clarifying that because I was thinking more of the okay, but the rate study. I'll leave that up to you guys. I'm sure that wouldn't be as much, but as long as you're following the debris plan and you think that's current and we know where we're going, we know what good looks like. And we've, you know, we're not just throwing money at it right now.

00:55:07,868	S18:
Okay.

00:55:08,567	S1:
So I think we've got some homework to go through the rates and give you some guidance. I do think there's a desire to increase rates at the right amount. Stay competitive. We don't want to just pass along costs. You know there's a lot going at residence Um, already, uh, for spend right now. But we need to look at this and kind of just clearly communicate the projects that lie ahead. And our strategy between debt and kind of rates and how we're going to, you know, complete these projects over the next five years. So I think if the board can come back after looking at that and give a little more guidance to Tim and Joe, that would be helpful. We can hone in on the right plan. Do we need anything as a board else to think about or look at? I want to like make a decision in our next meeting.

00:55:49,367	S2:
We probably have it, Tim. But if you can send us that Excel sheet again, just so it's easier to read than in the packets would be great.

00:55:57,601	S1:
Okay.

00:55:58,000	S18:
That work? Yeah that's fine. All right.

00:56:01,100	S1:
Good discussion. Thank you, Tim.

00:56:03,868	S18:
For a comment on one.

00:56:04,801	S15:
More thing because I'm jumping.

00:56:05,767	S18:
On we're not voting on public comment for this.

00:56:09,868	S15:
Okay. But there was a good friend of mine, I, uh, did a lot of, uh, had a lot of meetings with him, uh, a lot of, uh, health and assistance with the town hall, and I'm 100% behind that. So I want to let you guys know my feeling because I can't. I have to leave. I can't stay home. But, uh, I just I know that's going to be coming up in the meeting.

00:56:30,567	S1:
Okay, Tim, appreciate that feedback. I understand all that. You know, Jay has done for this town as well as the town hall project. So thank you for sharing your thoughts there.

00:56:38,601	S18:
Thank you.

00:56:39,200	S5:
Do you want to take public comment on this item?

00:56:41,367	S1:
Yeah, we're not voting, but we can take some public comment on water rates.

00:56:44,567	S18:
Yeah. Hi.

00:56:48,367	S4:
Just briefly. Jack Whittier, 35 Walden Field Road. When, um, when you're looking at a major capital expenditure like this and you're raising rates are a segment of it, but there's this water energy nexus thing and you're going to get really once you start talking about water, you're talking about pumping a lot of electricity gets into the pumping thing. So I would I would tie the if you're going to do a study, I would make sure you tie the water rate study to an electricity Stay. See what you can do with time and use rates. What you know. Variables and speed drives. Whatever it happens to be. Yeah. Um, I would not just look at rates because there's a lot of options there that can, you know, bring down operating costs. I mean, what you're getting to is this level I's costing.

00:57:38,000	S18:
Yeah, exactly.

00:57:39,100	S4:
And you're going to get CapEx, you're going to get opex, and you're going to try to put that together. I think it's close.

00:57:45,767	S18:
Look at that.

00:57:46,267	S2:
I think that plays well. Just understanding the Browns hill like water tanks being elevated in terms of like when we pump to fill those and looking at that, if there's options there, Tim, if that means upgrades to our pumping and control strategy, um, so that we can maybe pump at night when electricity is cheaper, maybe we're already doing some of that, but maybe there's some additional efficiency there.

00:58:10,300	S4:
And there's a fun level. Go ahead.

00:58:12,701	S18:
Tim.

00:58:13,667	S4:
Well, there's a fun little thing you can do.

00:58:15,901	S15:
Uh, we're actually lighting the, uh, busy. Uh, I don't know if he's still there. I think I saw her earlier. Uh, but she helped me, uh, put together a proposal, uh, Grant, uh, through National Grid, uh, for our water treatment plant. Uh, looking at, uh, we do have VFS on all our drives. There are a couple of smaller pumps, uh, qualified for some BFD credits through the gap. Um, and energy efficiency, uh, credits and grants. Um, we're also looking at solar on our roof. Um, that's something else that they are evaluating as well. So we are going through those efforts. Uh, the tank is another.

00:58:52,000	S18:
Waterproof.

00:58:52,501	S15:
Whole other element that we don't currently have. Um, but that's something we can look at, um, in the future for how, if there's ways to increase efficiencies. Uh, energy and electrical costs and things like that. But at our plant, we actually went through a study right now. Um, and, and Vicki has all that information for you.

00:59:13,567	S3:
Jim, can I just ask what's a BFG?

00:59:16,601	S18:
They're a little frequency grinder.

00:59:18,267	S15:
Just controls the, um, the British, um, pumping, um, rotation. Um, how hard the.

00:59:26,767	S18:
Water is working. How hard work? Um, so.

00:59:29,667	S15:
It's an easy kind of an increase. Gradual increase. Gradual decrease. Instead of a hard on off. Uh, that drives a lot of electricity.

00:59:38,200	S18:
So.

00:59:38,868	S15:
Uh, it controls the speed of the motor.

00:59:41,167	S3:
Okay.

00:59:41,567	S15:
Thank you.

00:59:43,100	S1:
So it sounds like you're looking at everything relative to operating expenses, even how to run the pumps and when and hard stops or not. You know, so it sounds like you appreciate that as well.

00:59:55,100	S15:
And we're also looking at several grants as well. So that's another we didn't get into it. But that's something else we are looking at as well. Um, to try to reduce some of these costs and funding, uh, alternative funding sources.

01:00:08,667	S18:
Mm.

01:00:10,267	S1:
Excellent.

01:00:11,367	S18:
Okay.

01:00:12,200	S1:
Any other comments anywhere across the room? Nope. All right. Let's keep moving. Good discussion. Yeah. If you can send that sheet around again, Tim, that'd be helpful. Or Joe. And we'll we'll put it on the next agenda.

01:00:25,267	S18:
I ask that you take the next two. Thanks, Jim. Out of order.

01:00:28,601	S5:
We'll take the next two counties together. So it's a notification to the high school group project. You just want to acknowledge that you received the notification from schools, and then it's going to lead into the next two discussion next to items anyway.

01:00:38,501	S18:
Yeah.

01:00:38,767	S1:
Which which I wanted to talk about even on the warrant order, it seemed like they were not together on the warrant article ordering, which maybe they should, just like we're putting them together now.

01:00:49,200	S18:
On the warrant.

01:00:50,567	S1:
Yeah. When the discussions about the override versus the operating budget isn't the the dead override way down in that order? Or did I have that wrong?

01:00:59,200	S5:
That exclusion is way down. But the operating override, the the two and a half overrides right after the the initial budget article. So we kept the budget articles together and then the the debt is the debt.

01:01:09,968	S1:
And you don't say like we're ordering together. You know what I'm saying? That's all. I'm just saying. It's a logical flow, in my opinion.

01:01:16,000	S5:
You've got them together because you're going to be looking at the ballot question. So both ballot questions.

01:01:21,067	S18:
For the ballot.

01:01:21,567	S1:
Tonight? Not at that time. Right. Okay.

01:01:24,000	S5:
So that would be the only ballot question on the ballot.

01:01:26,667	S1:
So okay. So um, we did receive notification.

01:01:30,667	S18:
Uh.

01:01:31,467	S1:
Yeah. Tom McKinney is here, uh, legal counsel for the town. Um, $10.3 million, uh, root system, uh, project for the schools, which is, I guess, subject to being reduced by MSBA grants. Correct. Which could total up to 45%, which would bring that cost down much needed uh, project, uh, from deferred maintenance. It will extend the life of the building, uh, and so forth. We've talked a little bit about, um, monies we can save with solar on top today, but, uh, I think this is just a discussion in recognition that we received the notification for the school. It will be on the ballot. And, um, if there's any further discussion on on this, we can have that right now. Did I miss anything?

01:02:18,467	S20:
No. The board will need to take a vote, though, on the specific ballot questions to add them to the warrant.

01:02:23,667	S18:
Which.

01:02:24,367	S1:
And those are in the.

01:02:25,000	S18:
Packet.

01:02:25,267	S20:
That's in the package. Correct?

01:02:32,100	S18:
Yes. Yes. So you could.

01:02:34,400	S1:
Go on to read these, both the second one or the first one or both.

01:02:37,667	S18:
Um, you could.

01:02:39,067	S5:
Take them one at a time or together as you.

01:02:41,000	S18:
See fit.

01:02:45,868	S1:
Okay. So why don't we take the second one first? I guess because that's the roof replacement system. So ballot question two would read, uh, shall the town of Hamilton be allowed to, uh, exempt from the provisions of proposition two and a half, so-called, the amounts required to pay the town's applicable share of the bond issued by the Hamilton one Regional School District for the purpose of paying costs of the roof system replacement at the Hamilton Wenham Regional High School, located at 775 Bay road, Hamilton, mass. Including the payment of all costs, incidental or related thereto. So we would not have a dollar amount on there.

01:03:21,100	S18:
Or that's correct.

01:03:22,267	S20:
For the debt exclusion question. There is no dollar amount that's included, and it's the same as we've had on several other projects in the past. With respect to the override, which would be the first question on the ballot, which is next on the agenda, there is an actual dollar amount included.

01:03:38,667	S1:
Okay. So it's consistent with prior language on.

01:03:40,968	S20:
Yeah, it's actually the statutory form. You statutory you have to use the statutory form. Correct.

01:03:46,100	S5:
The question was already reviewed by bond counsel and approved.

01:03:50,000	S20:
So and I would note that the debt exclusion question is a two thirds vote of the Select board to put it on the warrant.

01:04:04,901	S1:
Two thirds vote to put it on the warrant.

01:04:06,868	S18:
Correct. Yes. Okay.

01:04:08,067	S20:
By again. All statutory.

01:04:09,767	S18:
Yep.

01:04:11,167	S1:
Okay. Any discussion on, uh, from the board, on the language.

01:04:18,400	S3:
But during the presentation, there will be some discussion obviously, as to costs and, um, what roughly the MSBA grant will, um, defer or pay for. I'm sorry. Is there long term?

01:04:33,467	S1:
So will Eric Superintendent Treacy do that? The Finn comp planning on talking about anything? Both. Okay, great.

01:04:43,067	S1:
Yeah. I think Rosie, that, uh, definitely they would, uh, go through the, through the, uh, that have we looked at potential, you know, once what will be what will the average taxpayer pay in principal and interest on, on potential debt if we looked at that?

01:04:59,167	S14:
Hamilton is probably $30.

01:05:03,267	S18:
I think the total is 45.

01:05:06,767	S14:
It'll be 10 million less four and a half to get you to five. Six. That gets split in two when you get two thirds of that.

01:05:13,767	S18:
Got it?

01:05:15,000	S14:
We'll firm up a $30. I think that's probably what we're doing in that neighborhood.

01:05:20,367	S1:
And do we know the timing of the MSBA grant and the fact and whether or not we're accepted or we already passed that as the school applied? I'm looking at you. Sorry.

01:05:29,667	S7:
Yeah.

01:05:30,567	S3:
That's all been approved.

01:05:32,767	S1:
For the roof had already was accepted into the program. And there's not a, you know, because they're all applied based on needs of communities, right? So I just want to make sure they've got a green light or not. Yeah. Okay.

01:05:43,067	S18:
And the.

01:05:43,367	S14:
School committee voted.

01:05:44,767	S18:
Yes.

01:05:45,100	S14:
As.

01:05:45,267	S18:
Well.

01:05:46,167	S1:
But the letter to us was for the full amount.

01:05:48,968	S18:
Yeah. It has to be statutory. Yeah.

01:05:51,667	S20:
It's just. Yeah.

01:05:53,167	S18:
Okay.

01:05:55,267	S14:
The full value.

01:05:56,567	S18:
Yeah.

01:05:57,701	S1:
Okay. It seems clean to me. Anybody else? Ben.

01:06:00,667	S2:
Um, Vicki, I had a question because I know Vicky sometimes weighs in on these issues, kind of, especially when it crosses over the town. But, um, have we had any oversight in terms of, like the quality of the roof or, or what they're considering in terms of insulation levels or, um, solar readiness, things like that? Sorry.

01:06:22,100	S18:
Good question.

01:06:24,667	S21:
Um, hi. Vicky Moosonee, energy manager. Um, the the design process so far has been very prescriptive by MSBA. So, um, MSBA assigns a designer. It's um, Gail Associates I believe has taken the lead. Um, and they have a mechanical sub consultant who's doing all the mechanical design. So I haven't had a lot of insight into the, um, you know, into the design. I've seen the preliminary design report. What's interesting is they're also going to be replacing some mechanical equipment up there. That's at the end of life. So all that's built into this project, which I found interesting as far as you know, looking for grants for mechanical equipment. That's kind of what I do all the time. So I've been in touch with Curtis and Eric about that as it proceeds, but they're only at 60% design. So, um.

01:07:15,167	S2:
At that point it's pretty much baked like the 60% threshold, you know? So I mean, it's a little I'll just say this out loud. It's a little concerning, you know, that we're, you know, being asked to I know we're getting the grant money. And that's a prescriptive process from the MSBA. So we get 45%. That's great. However, we're going to live with the energy bills for the next 20 years. You know, when it comes to the equipment in the next 50 years when it comes to the roof, at least. So I'm kind of surprised that we're not more integrated in the process as towns when it comes back to the towns to pay for it. So, um, and also with the knowledge that we, you know, we have signed up to be kind of this green communities program, we do have our net zero goals that have already passed through the town. So and our schools are a big part of that. So I'm kind of I don't.

01:08:08,367	S18:
Know.

01:08:08,767	S1:
At 60%. You're saying, you know, we don't have impact or is there an ask here to make sure that we're in line with, you know, what we want to do to make sure, you.

01:08:17,601	S18:
Know, we sort of like.

01:08:18,467	S1:
Energy savings on insulation. You mentioned solar or all of that. Is it pretty work being done on that roof to accommodate?

01:08:24,767	S18:
Right.

01:08:25,267	S1:
Do we we don't have answers to that here.

01:08:27,267	S18:
Right.

01:08:28,267	S3:
Right. In the in the design that the the new roof will be, uh, part of the installation process is to be solar ready. So that's part of the project.

01:08:39,400	S1:
I thought I heard that too, but I haven't seen that design.

01:08:42,300	S21:
I can clarify, just MSBA because it's not a brand. If it was a brand new school, the 100% of the roof would have to be solar ready. They did do a preliminary structural analysis on the existing roof, and they found that 40% or something like that right now can safely be assumed as sole already. So they're saying that requirement is met.

01:09:01,567	S1:
So so 40% of the roof.

01:09:04,100	S21:
Of of what they're replacing. Just. Yeah. They're only replacing the high school. So the middle school is a different story, right.

01:09:10,167	S18:
But but how is that ready?

01:09:11,901	S5:
I mean, there won't be anything up there to allow us to hook in.

01:09:16,167	S21:
I think just structurally it has to be structurally solar ready, meaning it can bear the load.

01:09:21,467	S3:
Pre wired, right, in a sense.

01:09:24,100	S21:
Uh I don't I yeah.

01:09:26,968	S3:
The term budget is sort of preparing for at some point in the future. I yeah that's what I understand it to, to me.

01:09:37,767	S2:
I'm less concerned about the solar readiness honestly, and more concerned about the insulation levels that they're, that they're achieving. You know, that's the the big thing that it's going to last outlive. It'll outlive me, you know. Um, so I'm.

01:09:52,901	S5:
I'm we ask Eric and Curtis to confirm that for us and have that as part of the presentation at our meeting, that what the levels of insulation and solar readiness are.

01:10:04,367	S2:
And I'd like to see.

01:10:05,667	S18:
How it.

01:10:06,567	S2:
And specifically around the insulation levels, the equipment that they're specifying. You know, that's news to me as of today, that there's mechanical equipment going in as part of this project, sort of like with the boilers, you know, that were at the end of their life dying and then just replacing and kind because it's an emergency. How do these things map back to the commitments that the two towns have made? You know, it seems like a big gap in my knowledge right now. Um, so not.

01:10:33,000	S5:
It's a big gap and they're working to, to help.

01:10:36,400	S2:
That. I yeah, I don't know. I'm looking at Egypt, but it's not your.

01:10:39,100	S18:
Job.

01:10:39,501	S2:
Right. You know, kind of.

01:10:40,767	S1:
But maybe they ask whether it's.

01:10:42,067	S18:
With.

01:10:42,267	S1:
You or you and it's like we we a lot of questions risen tonight just about insulation, solar readiness, mechanical equipment being replaced.

01:10:49,467	S2:
Uh, yeah. Because it was kind of a mess with the boilers. Right. It's like if they had done this all together. You know, we could have gotten, you know, 40 to 50% of all the HVAC upgrades if they'd gone geothermal or done ESCO like we did with the town hall. You know, so that's just like, you know, it's sort of this thing where it's like, oh, there's money from MSBA. Great. There's all this other money too, and these other opportunities that could help out with the what we're paying for energy bills over the next, you know, 30 to 40, 50 years too. So, um, I feel like there's there's a gap, the knowledge gap on the school committee that needs to be closed because they're coming back to the townspeople to ask us to pay for it. Yeah. And it's. Yeah. And we have you as such a great resource. I would, you know, really like to see them engaging more. Uh, sorry, I might go off my high horse on that.

01:11:38,567	S1:
Well, I just don't know if we haven't been paying attention or they haven't been proactive. I haven't been paying attention. I mean, to the design process, but you're in.

01:11:47,767	S18:
Lockstep.

01:11:48,267	S21:
Yeah. The last one I saw was the 30% design. I've been trying to get the 60% design out of Curtis and Eric, because I guess that was just released a couple of weeks ago, but I haven't seen that yet. I haven't been able to get.

01:11:59,100	S18:
It.

01:11:59,267	S1:
So that would be good to, you know, if somebody could bring it to this board and just kind of drill into those insulation, all the stuff we just talked about. That'd be helpful. Um, I don't know what we do with that at this stage, but.

01:12:10,167	S2:
Probably.

01:12:10,501	S18:
Not.

01:12:10,667	S2:
Much. But just it's kind of like guys like, yeah, the boiler was bad enough. It feels like it's happening again. So let's get on a track where kind of.

01:12:22,300	S1:
Yeah. Rosie, did you have something?

01:12:24,801	S3:
Well, I just, um, I just wanted to just comment that just the middle school roof needs to be replaced, and we're just putting that off. For some reason, I thought it was both the high school and the middle school, since it is, in reality, pretty much.

01:12:42,400	S1:
I mean, they all run on the same meter, right?

01:12:44,467	S21:
The same meter. But there's just the high school.

01:12:46,100	S18:
Roof.

01:12:46,801	S21:
Just the high school roof. So to get even into MSBA, the roof has to be a certain age and the middle school roof is not that age yet.

01:12:55,367	S3:
Are there any leaks in the middle school roof that you're aware of?

01:12:58,501	S18:
I don't know.

01:12:59,868	S1:
Come on, dad, I don't know.

01:13:02,501	S22:
I don't know about that.

01:13:04,501	S1:
No, we don't know.

01:13:06,567	S5:
I haven't heard about leaks in middle school roof. But that doesn't mean that there aren't any. So it could be.

01:13:14,667	S3:
I just it is astounding. I mean, I just I think we're all sort of astounded at the cost to put in a new roof on a building. I mean, I've been communicating with, with Vinny and he is likewise astounded. There's just no other word for.

01:13:33,267	S7:
It.

01:13:33,467	S23:
Like in detail.

01:13:34,868	S3:
Anyhow. But nonetheless, he does need to be done, and I certainly agree with that.

01:13:39,868	S1:
So tonight's discussion around this debt exclusion is just accepting the language.

01:13:45,300	S5:
Except the language that can go on the ballot. That's what both ballot questions. And then when we get into the warrant, all the all the questions and stuff around the war questions.

01:13:51,767	S1:
So it sounds like we have some open questions we want to hear more about, you know, prior to our town meeting, or maybe that might kind of go into the, the, the report maybe Eric gives on it, you know, for it, you know, what what he's accomplishing.

01:14:03,467	S18:
But but we.

01:14:04,901	S5:
Do we do have a deadline.

01:14:05,868	S18:
So yeah.

01:14:06,667	S5:
So we need the vote.

01:14:07,701	S1:
To I will take a motion or if there's further discussion I'll take that first. But otherwise we'll take a motion to accept, uh, the language on prop two and hat. Two and a half dead exclusion for the high school roof replacement.

01:14:22,267	S1:
Yeah, sure. Yeah. We were. We allowed for.

01:14:24,467	S18:
That. So I just thank you.

01:14:26,000	S7:
And just to make.

01:14:26,868	S11:
Sure I understand it. So. So from the discussion, it seems like there isn't really a plan yet for what the roof is going to look like and how it's going to be implemented. Is that true?

01:14:36,300	S1:
There is a plan. There's a design plan that's out there. We just haven't gone through it and asked and probed in on some questions that were brought up tonight relative to equipment that we learned is being replaced and insulation levels and and we understand the solar readiness. We know what's there, but not how much, what capacity or what structurally can be done on how much of the roof and how that impacts, Emmet said earlier. 200 K but if we don't have enough space up there for solar, is it really 200 K or are we fractional? I don't know.

01:15:02,100	S11:
And the school committee kind of owns this discussion. They own that plan because they're renting the buildings. Right. So sort of all in their court. But then they give us the bill. Right.

01:15:11,367	S1:
That's right.

01:15:11,868	S11:
And it's over $10 million. Is that right for the roof? And yet the question doesn't have that number in it. So when do the residents find us? If they're going to the ballot, they're just going to see sort of an override for the for the operating expenses of one something. Right. And then there's the second question that just says, I agree to some, you know, I agree to paying the debt, but there's no number on it. Like there's no information. It's just sort of a blank check or something like, when does that money get?

01:15:43,667	S1:
Is there a report on the 10.3 specifically that will follow.

01:15:46,667	S18:
It was.

01:15:47,667	S11:
Not on the ballot.

01:15:48,300	S18:
Question.

01:15:48,667	S20:
There's two parts to it. This there's a vote at town meeting whether.

01:15:52,367	S18:
This is.

01:15:52,667	S20:
The batteries, the dead or not, and that will have the specific dollar amount in it. And then the question that's on the ballot is whether to exclude that debt due a debt exclusion. Essentially, it excludes that from the levy limit.

01:16:06,567	S18:
From.

01:16:07,501	S20:
Paying the debt, the debt service.

01:16:10,467	S11:
So it's only at the town meeting that the number is known and gets approved, that that's the amount. And then the second step is that we have to agree to have it not be part of two and a half. So if the second.

01:16:21,701	S5:
Vote can't, can't exceed the the authorization for town meeting. So whatever the number is that they give us in town meeting is the amount that we'd be able to raise that exclusion would we wouldn't be able to go more than that.

01:16:32,501	S11:
But why why is that number not on the question so that people can see that and have that be kind of part of their thinking, knowing that that's going.

01:16:38,467	S18:
To be statute.

01:16:39,868	S20:
Has a specific form of ballot question and the ballot. Question for exclusion does not include the number in it. You're required to use the state statutory form.

01:16:49,667	S11:
So if it doesn't pass at the ballot, it doesn't pass.

01:16:54,267	S20:
That's correct because the vote is contingent. The town meeting vote is contingent upon the approval of the debt exclusion vote.

01:17:02,801	S7:
Okay.

01:17:03,667	S14:
We will we'll ask the superintendent to lay all the costs out and the split. Yeah. On by town. Yeah. Tax impact.

01:17:11,767	S11:
At the town.

01:17:12,267	S7:
Meeting.

01:17:12,968	S14:
Exactly the same thing.

01:17:14,067	S11:
Right. That town meeting. And then theoretically, that has to get out because a lot of people can't get to town meeting as we know.

01:17:19,667	S14:
Book recommendations two weeks prior to the meeting.

01:17:22,968	S11:
And people will understand that the ballot question relates to that.

01:17:26,067	S14:
We will make sure it's in there.

01:17:27,567	S7:
Okay.

01:17:28,267	S1:
But right or wrong, I think your point a lot more people go to the ballot box. Right. And they're not they're kind of like blank. You know, they don't have no idea. I mean.

01:17:35,167	S7:
10 million.

01:17:35,567	S11:
Is a huge number for a roof.

01:17:36,667	S1:
Like I'm a little surprised at that myself.

01:17:38,267	S11:
It's like an enormous number. I feel like.

01:17:40,567	S5:
That's.

01:17:41,100	S2:
Six after the.

01:17:42,367	S5:
And it was the same. It was. It's the same exact process. It's the trophy followed us. Exactly. Yeah, exactly. So we had all the meeting and how much the turkey was going to cost and all the explanation of town meeting and the, the ballot question was firstly, the same exact question.

01:17:56,868	S11:
So the 10 million so theoretically that 10 million is going to be reduced by some grant that we're going to find out.

01:18:02,367	S7:
Between now.

01:18:03,067	S5:
4.5 MSBA is already.

01:18:04,767	S1:
Like 45%.

01:18:06,300	S11:
So that ten is already reduced to six something. And then the Hamilton portion is 65% of that.

01:18:11,567	S5:
Right. So yeah, $4 million for Hamilton's side okay.

01:18:14,901	S11:
And all that's going to be sort of.

01:18:16,167	S7:
Known.

01:18:16,567	S14:
About if you walk into the ballot box.

01:18:19,767	S11:
It just seemed to me a little bit confusing as to I mean, I know we've done it before for multiple times, but every time it's like, wait, I just want transparency as to what what the amount is that's going to be taken on as debt. Right? And not just sort of it just felt like, but separate from the town meeting, as long as it's understood.

01:18:38,267	S14:
A little bit more context for the last four years, we've been projecting this through that 5 or $6 million, as well as the water projects at $10 million. So we've been projecting this for the last 4 or 5 years if you've been paying attention.

01:18:59,067	S1:
Yeah, that's the operative word there. I understand to say to pay our share of applicable share.

01:19:06,000	S14:
Will you have to run again?

01:19:07,467	S2:
Yeah.

01:19:08,367	S1:
Right.

01:19:08,868	S14:
Well, we'll make sure it's in the book recommendations. We'll ask Eric to. He'll explain it similar to what he did with the school and got it out there.

01:19:20,067	S7:
And I just want to encourage like you guys since we have to pay for it. Right. But we're not involved in it. It's just one of these weird things, right, where they get to decide what to do, but then we pay for it. Like I, I wish there could be more of an iterative.

01:19:33,100	S11:
Engagement with the towns, right? Like like Ben saying, like we should be involved in some of this process, right? Right. Because we might want to add a little bit more to make it a better long term something. Whereas the school may or may not have that same interest, they're trying to get it done. So anyway.

01:19:51,767	S14:
I'll just make a couple of comments. John McGrath. So we've been talking about the high school roof for about five years. Um, in the multiple, um, meetings we've had with the school this year, five chairs, um, public meetings, five boards, five boards. Um, five chair meeting and five board meeting. Right. We've been talking about this roof and the fact that it's going to be an override. Um, Eric has offered, uh, multiple times to brief whoever wants to know about it and is more than willing to go through the details. He is following the MSBA process. And because he is, he was able to get $4.5 million of grant money. So just to be fair to everybody. It's been a multi year conversation and over the last six months a multi meeting conversation. And most of those meetings are public. So just to kind of talk about transparency it's out there. If you so choose to roll up your sleeves dig into a meeting and ask them questions. And you can always come to a fin con meeting and we'll fill you in as well. So I understand the passion and the interest.

01:21:16,267	S5:
That's John asking for an audience not really know.

01:21:20,901	S1:
Without a doubt, it's been out there and and we've been highlighting this for years to your point. But I bet if we took a poll to 100 people, they're not going to know the dollar amount in town. Yeah, sure.

01:21:37,367	S5:
It's got an old 12 old car.

01:21:39,400	S1:
Oh. You moved?

01:21:40,200	S5:
Um. Oh, good to see you all. Um, greatly appreciate the work you do, all the meetings you.

01:21:46,767	S24:
Have, all the meetings at the fin com has.

01:21:49,901	S5:
Um.

01:21:50,701	S24:
And this is actually a well attended meeting, relatively, uh, to reach the voters. I think we should learn from the last school failed vote where there were 400 new, never attended before town meeting voters. So they don't come to these meetings. You know, you produce great stuff, John. Uh, I challenge anybody here to open up a town PDF and try to read on your phone and get all what you want to get. Um, I think your your communication with the schools into the public should change radically and go into the social media world. You should fund that. You should have clear graphics and summaries of what's going on. Solicit information that way, because that's how the voters are getting this stuff. Yeah. So this is great. Great. Glad you're having the Warren hearings are following the laws and the rules and regs. But the world is different. We've got high attention uh, have decreased decreased trust in the schools. Um, if we don't change how we communicate, I can't see how we're going to get a different outcome.

01:23:09,901	S1:
Yeah. No, what we do is great, but it doesn't scale to the larger audience for sure. And it is interesting to David's point that a fall short of a dollar amount, I don't know what the harm would that would be, but the ballot question.

01:23:21,300	S5:
Right.

01:23:22,000	S24:
So I would suggest I've asked Joe this to include in this year's budget for the town, it's always tight, but to start doing more social media budgeting and communication work that with the schools?

01:23:34,100	S5:
Definitely.

01:23:34,868	S24:
So because it's hard to pick up this information as a. Even though as informed everybody is here digging into it sounds great and being a concerned citizen is great, but how do you really find out? Stuff for the majority of the voters are going to show up in April and vote.

01:23:52,767	S5:
Yeah, okay. Thank you. All right. That is the same way. Well, we need to take a vote on this.

01:23:57,200	S1:
Yeah, we need to take a vote. We did motions already. Right. Or take a motion of a seconded. Uh, good discussion everybody. Um, so I'll do a roll call vote starting with you, Rosie, on the language for the debt exclusion.

01:24:09,767	S3:
President Kennedy time.

01:24:11,601	S1:
Uh, Tom.

01:24:13,100	S15:
Tom Ayers.

01:24:14,200	S1:
Band.

01:24:14,968	S2:
Ben A.

01:24:15,968	S1:
And Bill Wilson I so we're good with the debt exclusion language. Do we need to go through the same thing in the operating override for the town?

01:24:23,100	S5:
I think we should we should read the question. And then when you get to it, just ask, when do you provide the number again? I think it's I know it's 1.3 something. Um.

01:24:32,300	S1:
Yeah.

01:24:33,000	S5:
Is it is that number in there? Tom, did you include the number in the the.

01:24:36,868	S1:
So we include the number of hours.

01:24:38,200	S5:
Included in its in the in the override is included. Yes. And the operating override did the number right.

01:24:43,300	S1:
But so what's the difference from a statute you said like we include the number in ballot one. But question two on the debt exclusion. We don't. What's the differentiator there.

01:24:53,367	S25:
That's how the statute.

01:24:54,667	S20:
Is written.

01:24:55,300	S5:
Okay. So like.

01:24:56,167	S20:
Operating. And it's also, surprisingly enough, a debt exclusion. Um, the ballot question to approve a debt exclusion vote is a two thirds vote of the Select board to put it on the warrant and override, which has, you know, arguably a greater and longer impact is a majority vote, and you have to include the dollar amount. So the way the statutes are active.

01:25:19,367	S5:
What you write with the number, you want to read it.

01:25:21,467	S1:
Yeah, I'll read it. So the ballot question reads, as shall the town of Hamilton be allowed to assess an additional 1,340,505.

01:25:30,067	S1:
Wendy can confirm that number for me after I'm done in real estate and personal property taxes for the purpose of funding the operating budget of the town and its assessment for the Hamilton one Regional School District budget for the fiscal year beginning July 1st, 2026. So when that number is still good. Wendy.

01:25:50,000	S1:
And do. Okay. And do we we don't reference the split of the number between what what's from the district versus the town or. That's not part of this.

01:25:59,601	S5:
No.

01:26:00,767	S1:
Will that be part of a discussion and town meeting.

01:26:03,067	S5:
Part of the discussion at town meeting. Okay. And and in all literature and social media posts I make between now and then.

01:26:08,567	S1:
Okay. Well, I like I mean, this seems pretty thorough, including the number. Um, so, um, I'll entertain a motion first and then we can have some discussion for ballot. Question number one.

01:26:23,868	S1:
Ben, since you're here.

01:26:25,367	S5:
Oh, sorry.

01:26:26,567	S1:
Uh, so you can just so moved.

01:26:28,267	S2:
Yeah. I'm sorry.

01:26:28,901	S1:
All right. Do I have a second? All right. Any further discussion on the language of ballot? Question one?

01:26:38,067	S5:
Just by way of providing information. Since it was just raised by Mr. Matter, I'd say that the town side of the override does include $50,000 that would be used to enhance communications with the public. That was part of my goal for the Select board. It was in the original budget request, but as we were asked to make very, very difficult decisions on what we could live without, if we had to, that went into the pocket of things that would have to be covered by the override.

01:27:03,501	S2:
And that. Scott.

01:27:05,501	S1:
No, and we'll itemize that.

01:27:07,067	S5:
He missed all. Yeah. That's okay.

01:27:08,300	S2:
You were saying something about attention?

01:27:12,167	S1:
No, I was texting a minute, but, uh. Okay. Any other I know we're we've got a lot ahead of us. Still. I just want to keep the meeting moving and be efficient here. Any other discussion on that language or any other additional information we want out of this. I think we do have a. It's further down in the agenda as well. But, uh, any discussion on the ballot? Uh, language.

01:27:33,968	S3:
Well, I would just like to make a comment that I, um, appreciate Scott's, uh, comments about communication. I think that, um, the onus of this requirement is on the school district and the school, um, district, because they're the ones who are asking for a very large override, and they're the ones who really need to explain this to the public. I don't think it should be on, on the the plate of the select board, since it's it's not us. Right. It's it's not us. And we don't we're not privy to their to their thought process. So I, I just would probably take a little exception to that. It's not our responsibility to Explain the school department's reasoning. It's theirs. And yes, I agree, they should be very, um, communicative and very transparent with the public. And I would expect that they will be.

01:28:36,868	S26:
Yeah. Mhm.

01:28:38,567	S1:
Yeah. I think it's, you know that we're not privy is the thing I like to change. Right. And I think that's what Scott might have been talking about too. It's like the collaboration and the knowledge we have before, instead of going back and asking questions about mechanical equipment etc., etc. on what they're doing.

01:28:53,467	S27:
Could I add one more thing?

01:28:55,067	S24:
Um, I think it is your job. Uh, the Selectboard, by law, uh, calls a meeting, brings the warrant. Bingham needs to advise on that. There's all sorts of topics in there. You get experts, Tim, talking about water. Uh, more integration with the schools is better for us. And you take a position on each warrant article. We do so to get educated, and your job to help communicate to your voters is part of your job. And therefore, I think you should be funded with technology to help you do that easier.

01:29:33,100	S5:
Um, agree?

01:29:34,367	S1:
Don't disagree. It's in the budget. Well, hopefully. Hopefully. But I do agree there's opportunity there. And I will also recognize a lot of progress has been made in the fin com working hand in hand. And the boards and chair meetings. There's been a lot but definitely always room for improvement. So uh, with that said we can do a roll call vote on the language of ballot. Question one starting with you Rosie.

01:29:57,067	S3:
Rosie Kennedy, I.

01:29:58,667	S1:
Tom.

01:30:00,567	S15:
Myers, I.

01:30:01,868	S1:
Benjamin.

01:30:02,567	S2:
Ben Losa, I.

01:30:03,667	S1:
Uh, Bill Walsh and I and uh, Bill Bill Olsen never joined. Correct. Okay.

01:30:09,801	S5:
No worries. I will just add the these questions will be put onto a form that will include space for your signatures. I don't have two of you in the room tonight anyway, so we'll get that ready for you this week. We need it signed so that it can be sent to the state by the town clerk. So I'd ask you all to work with my office or the clerk to make sure that you get it signed this week, please.

01:30:31,767	S2:
Is that for.

01:30:32,267	S24:
Both of these?

01:30:33,167	S5:
Yes, but we can include. I think we can include them on one sheet. Yeah.

01:30:36,667	S20:
So yes that's.

01:30:37,367	S5:
Correct with signature block Farley. So. Okay.

01:30:39,767	S2:
All right.

01:30:40,367	S1:
And I do I gotta say it one more time, I do think it's disappointing that we say our applicable share versus a dollar amount. And I think it helps the schools cause it's not to throw a shockwave out there. It's hey, we need this. You know, it's some I'm surprised I don't I agree I mean I understand statutory language and such, but it's surprising we don't put the dollar amount in there for what it's worth.

01:31:03,767	S20:
Yeah. I don't disagree with you, but yeah.

01:31:06,868	S1:
No, I appreciate it.

01:31:08,100	S25:
Just start with the statute.

01:31:10,067	S3:
So I'll ask the question. Could we put it there or are we not allowed to.

01:31:14,467	S1:
No. I think what I heard was now out of that earlier.

01:31:17,100	S20:
Correct? You have to follow the statutory form and it's not in the form.

01:31:21,467	S26:
Okay.

01:31:22,567	S1:
I appreciate that discussion. So we'll move now to finalize and potentially close the Warren right for town meeting I think we had. Oh go ahead.

01:31:32,501	S5:
Yeah I was going to say, if you don't mind me setting it up for you. So you got, um, the the draft warrant has been done by Tom. Uh, I will note a couple of things for you. The draft warrant includes a placeholder for any citizen petition questions. But as of close of business today, there were no citizen petition questions that have been entered. So you'll close the warrant this evening? I'll need a vote for you to close the warrant. And that means there will be no citizen petition questions on this town meeting. So we can take that back block out of the timing warrant. That's one thing. The other thing is you can go through any or all of the articles in the warrant, but the main job is to close the warrant with what it is you want on there. So you've got the draft. If there are any of the items that we've highlighted, the ones that aren't. Not necessarily guaranteed to be on sale of patent homestead. Gun club lease renewals, specialized stretch code, prudent investment rule and they meet operating override and debt exclusion boats. You've already approved the ballot question language. I would assume the other two will have to get approved. Those we can we can do some things within the warrant as far as explaining splits and things like that and what the money is going to. So we have more time between tonight's vote and when we finalize the warrant language to actually work on that stuff tonight. You just want to clarify which of these items are going to be on the warrant and then vote to close the work.

01:32:50,300	S1:
Okay. And are we going to just focus on these bulleted in the agenda, or do we want to walk through the articles as outlined.

01:32:56,868	S5:
Completely up to you about.

01:32:57,767	S2:
It?

01:32:58,267	S1:
I mean, I'm good with just walking through the ones outlined. I mean, do we even have prior year bills or Wendy?

01:33:03,801	S5:
Do we have prior year bills? I don't think we do.

01:33:05,767	S9:
No. Can I just make one comment?

01:33:07,267	S17:
Yes we do. Actually, we don't have a total clean right now though. Okay.

01:33:10,801	S9:
He has to leave if you have any questions for her.

01:33:14,267	S15:
Um.

01:33:15,901	S1:
So why don't we just, um. Since Vicky's here. Thank you. Um. Uh, why don't we. Why don't we jump to the specialized stretch code? Is that alright with everybody? I know there's a couple things we had above it, but, um, I think that's kind of the the meat of the order right now for discussion. We had a good robust discussion. I think at our last meeting, uh, we had asked for some follow up. We got a one pager. Um, still, there's some clarity, I think, from things made in public comment relative to, you know, um, some of the requirements we talked about, it's only effects, you know, some of the larger, uh, home pre wire. And we went through the cost on that. I think we had some questions on ADUs. And I think from what I'm reading, the differentiator is whether or not it's a separate attachment. It would. But if it's part of the house it would not because I'm hearing it, it does apply and I'm here and it doesn't apply in certain things. But I think that is the differentiator. Correct?

01:34:07,167	S2:
Well.

01:34:07,667	S5:
You already asked for also asked for Rich Maloney to be here.

01:34:10,200	S1:
Yes. And I'm going to get to that next.

01:34:11,868	S5:
Year as well. Vicki and Rich here at your request. Okay. Um, so.

01:34:16,167	S1:
So why don't we just do that, then why don't we, um. Because we didn't have the pleasure of you last time. Why don't we start with you? And we know you had some thoughts on this, and the board was very interested to get your input on this code. So maybe we start with that, if that's okay. Sure, sure.

01:34:29,400	S5:
Sure. So, uh.

01:34:31,367	S2:
Sorry.

01:34:31,767	S28:
The hot seat. The hot seat. Um.

01:34:37,000	S28:
So I'm involved with the building codes for a long time. Um, I'll give you my. I sent you a memo. It's been about a year, right, Jo? February of 2025. Joe asked me for my opinion. Emmett asked me for my opinion. Um, so prior to 2003, there were four national building codes throughout the country. And in the early 2000, those uh, four national codes came together and formed the ICC, the International Code Council. And nationwide, we have one building code that everybody uses. It's used internationally also.

01:35:11,801	S5:
Um, that's.

01:35:12,767	S28:
A great thing. Uniformity in the construction industry. And in 2008, uh, Deval Patrick was the governor of Massachusetts, and they came up with the Green Communities Act and came up with the stretch energy code, which, um, after everything that happened in the building code industry, we get uniformity. And what does Massachusetts do? Throws a wrench into the uniformity. So from 2008, I have opposed the stretch energy code from its inception. And now we come with the specialized. There's actually four energy codes in Massachusetts. You're going to have the regular IEC. You can have the stretch. We are a stretch community so it isn't one of them. This is a specialized opt in code. This is a third option. And there is other options. Um, there's one more option. It's it's so confusing. Um, anyway, so I am against it, I am on I am a part of a building. Officials. We are in ICC educational chapter. So my ICC voting member and I'm an ICC we we run a non-profit education arm for ICC. So that is a philosophical thing. So I am against any other anything other than the basic energy code. The basic energy code gets upgraded every three years in Massachusetts. In that 2008 Green Communities Act by statutes, has to adopt the most recent energy code change within six months of its inception. So just by that the energy code changes. It gets upgraded every three years.

01:36:47,400	S1:
When was the last time it was updated?

01:36:49,968	S28:
2023.

01:36:50,901	S5:
Right.

01:36:52,901	S28:
Um, and the irony of it that in 2018, the, the ICC, the International Energy Conservation Code, surpassed Massachusetts stretch energy code. And if you're a.

01:37:06,868	S9:
Stretch.

01:37:07,267	S28:
Community, you you couldn't use the new code. You had to use the outdated stretch code. So just the dynamics of it. As I predicted in 2008, what would happen that did happen. So anyway, so that's that's why I'm against it. It's a local thing. You guys are already a stretch community. So it's a you know, it's up to the voters. I guess that's really my my take on it. The specialized opt in code only applies to new structures. And then there's two levels. So um, you have to pre wire. If you're going to use any carbon fuel you're going to you have to pre wire the house. So if you've got a gas furnace you get a pre wire for all electric uh you know mini splits that kind of thing. You got to get ready. So Emmett to the excellent job. We sat down. You know it was a great asset was the electrical inspector Dennis Curran. He really was the guy that gave us the insight of what the changes would cost, and that meant put together an estimate what it would cost for a new house. If you want to go with fossil fuels and the difference in that house. And then there's another level. If the house is greater than 4000ft² now, it has to not be solar ready. It has to have solar on it.

01:38:25,667	S1:
That's all there.

01:38:26,167	S2:
On it.

01:38:26,801	S9:
Both situations are not happening. So they changed it just in the last two months.

01:38:32,467	S28:
Yeah, I can't even I can't even I can't even.

01:38:35,100	S2:
Keep.

01:38:35,267	S28:
Up. You have to have a third party and a hers reader on all new dwellings. It's a third party. It's so complex that they are telling us that the House complies and they do inspections and give us paperwork.

01:38:51,200	S2:
Is that already with the structure?

01:38:52,801	S28:
Already? Already?

01:38:53,868	S2:
Yes. The one that we're already in. That's correct. Okay.

01:38:58,400	S28:
So anyway. And that leads to somebody had said earlier that once you're once you're into it, they can make changes. So they've already made changes. Right, exactly. Um, so.

01:39:09,767	S15:
Retrofit.

01:39:10,567	S9:
Old houses for the future.

01:39:14,300	S28:
Right now it is. Anyway. So, um.

01:39:19,567	S28:
So that's it. So there's two levels, uh, ADUs. So detached. ADUs, um, will have to comply.

01:39:29,567	S5:
With.

01:39:29,868	S28:
The, uh, opt in code.

01:39:32,567	S2:
The current stretch code.

01:39:34,167	S28:
If they comply with the stretch code, they do have a reduced energy rating index, though.

01:39:40,467	S5:
Um.

01:39:41,567	S28:
I, there were there were some kind of problems getting these things to meet the energy rating index because they're smaller. Uh, but so they have a, uh, a new house with fossil fuel is, uh, 42 on the energy rating index. Uh, completely. Uh, solar house is a 45. You get three. The lower is the harder number to get, obviously. Uh, and the 80 use can be between 52 to 58, I believe. So there's some kind of trouble getting the smaller units to comply with the energy rating index that's current. Um, so the A to use, because by statute, by statute, there can only be 900ft². So they'll never have to have that fourth out. They're never going to cross the 4000 square foot threshold. But you're saying that they have to have solar.

01:40:35,968	S29:
A minimal amount of minimal.

01:40:37,667	S9:
4K for the you.

01:40:40,567	S4:
You're talking about.

01:40:41,267	S29:
88, 80.

01:40:42,801	S9:
Anything under 4000ft² is 4K. Anything above has to, uh, provide.

01:40:49,267	S28:
All right. So the add a new new new new detached day to use under the specialized option to have solar.

01:40:58,467	S28:
Did not exempt the only exemption and the only exemption in the energy code for the for the ADUs now is the reduced energy rating.

01:41:09,100	S2:
So can we.

01:41:09,567	S6:
Just over 4000ft² that are not all electric, must install enough solar or other renewables to offset all of the home's energy use? So you're saying it's great? Oh, this is great. It's like anything over 4000.

01:41:25,167	S28:
That's what I said.

01:41:26,167	S29:
Yeah.

01:41:27,267	S28:
So there's no requirement to have solar on less than 4000 square foot house.

01:41:32,000	S29:
So that's what you're saying.

01:41:34,100	S9:
It's 4K of solar.

01:41:36,100	S29:
On.

01:41:36,667	S9:
Less than 4000 square foot.

01:41:38,267	S29:
Houses.

01:41:39,000	S5:
For KW.

01:41:39,868	S29:
Working here.

01:41:41,067	S28:
Are you sure?

01:41:43,701	S9:
We can double check that. But yeah, I'm pretty sure.

01:41:46,467	S28:
I thought that.

01:41:48,868	S5:
You have to have somebody raising their hand and still can tell from the state of the art, I don't.

01:41:52,767	S29:
Know.

01:41:53,868	S1:
Yeah, we do have Dylan's online. Can you help clarify that? Yeah. Let's that's. Why don't we recognize Dylan if he's listening to that specific.

01:42:02,367	S5:
He raised his hand.

01:42:03,367	S1:
All right, Dylan.

01:42:05,601	S30:
Thank you for recognizing me. My name is Dylan. I'm with the Massachusetts Department of Energy Resources community division. Um, new construction houses that are greater than 4000ft² have to have enough solar to be net zero. New construction houses that are smaller than 4000ft², up to a minimum of four kilowatts of solar. Accessory dwelling units that are detached from our specialized structure code.

01:42:35,167	S15:
Um.

01:42:36,067	S30:
Regulations, which could include solar. But realistically, you're not going to have enough room space to do it. So even though it's technically required practically, you'd be exempt.

01:42:51,667	S1:
Claire is.

01:42:52,868	S28:
How do you infer?

01:42:53,801	S5:
That's ridiculous.

01:42:56,501	S1:
Yeah, yeah, that's, uh, I fought the state in a lot of this and clarity. And how do you follow it? But.

01:43:03,367	S2:
Well, so.

01:43:04,767	S5:
I mean, just observe that we asked the EIC to come up with a one pager and in just in a couple of days since we asked them to come up with a one pager, the rule changed. I it's just.

01:43:16,200	S29:
No.

01:43:16,901	S1:
No, it was it's in the one pager less than four.

01:43:19,901	S2:
Yeah, it's been incorporated. You guys sat down with the electrical specialist as well. So those changes that happened two months ago have been incorporated.

01:43:29,467	S1:
Exactly.

01:43:30,167	S6:
Yeah, it is in that box now, I see. Home type.

01:43:32,767	S1:
Yeah. To the right.

01:43:33,501	S6:
Field. Less than 4000ft². Does take the four kilowatts.

01:43:37,300	S2:
And unless it's a passive. Yeah.

01:43:40,300	S1:
So how is that, like, can someone size that for me. Watts for four kilowatt equal for panels. Is that.

01:43:48,400	S29:
No.

01:43:49,167	S2:
No idea.

01:43:51,000	S4:
350W for module.

01:43:53,300	S5:
So just do the math.

01:43:55,167	S1:
Okay.

01:43:56,567	S3:
So can I ask a question of Dylan?

01:43:59,601	S1:
Yes, Rosie.

01:44:01,267	S3:
I have just two questions. Um, when I was reading over this, um, specialized code, two questions to specific questions regarding renovations. Um, I'm. I'm hearing you say that that it's new construction. Um, there's there's a section in the specialized code which you could probably, uh, which you would probably know about more than me, but like where there's language that talks about, um, renovations over 1000ft² needing to comply with the specialized code and further, um, as an adjunct that if you're doing a renovation on your house and you decide to knock down 50% of it and rebuild it. That becomes a new building. Um, can you just talk to those to both those points and explain them?

01:45:03,267	S30:
So any renovation that's made to a dwelling. Um, that is over 1000ft². Has to follow scratch code rules that are currently in place in Charleston. Um, I don't believe that there is any language in the appendices that make up the specialized code that refer to any existing, um, any existing building. A partial destruction and reconstruction. Um, my question is, it depends if you're following a new concept or not.

01:45:44,000	S29:
Okay.

01:45:44,367	S30:
If you are, then you would have to follow this code resolution.

01:45:48,901	S29:
And.

01:45:49,567	S30:
Say, um, ultimately. Yeah. Um.

01:45:54,467	S29:
Yeah.

01:45:54,901	S3:
Right. But if you take.

01:45:56,601	S23:
Them down, they.

01:45:58,501	S3:
Should be able to you. I mean, there was there was a question there about needing to follow the specialized and and then just as one follow up question to that, um, do I understand correctly that the that the stretch code that we are enrolled in now, if we opt for the specialized code, then we will incorporate all the changes to the stretch code along with the specialized code. Do I do I have do I understand that correctly?

01:46:35,868	S30:
Yes. But you already do that.

01:46:38,367	S17:
Mhm.

01:46:39,200	S3:
Okay. All right. So we already all of the changes in 2023. And subsequently we would need to adhere to for the stretch code.

01:46:51,367	S30:
You're doing that now.

01:46:53,467	S3:
Okay. Okay. Okay. So? So there would be no change to that. Okay. So thank you.

01:47:01,767	S2:
Um, one of the other questions that somebody I think brought up around, um, you know, power outages. And so, you know, it's common a lot of times if people live in more rural communities, maybe they have a propane generator if they're not connected to the natural gas system, is that is that allowed? Is that.

01:47:23,601	S28:
No penalty?

01:47:24,300	S2:
No penalty for that. So if people want a backup generator, they can do it that way if they're not connected to the gas, if they fall under one of the all electric options. Okay.

01:47:35,267	S30:
Yes, you may have a backup generation unit and still be classed as an all electric house if you have electric heat or water, but it's frightening. And, um. and what if you do?

01:47:53,400	S1:
Any any comments on. We had some questions about, uh, the state being able to fund some of these initiatives on a go forward. I think I read something in the one pager that 27 grants were funded, but any insight relative to the funding availability go. Going forward, we talk about years and years of savings and such, but do you see any risk in funding with the state?

01:48:15,901	S3:
Well, I think already the, the um, Statehouse News Corps, which I read um, this morning, there's already been $1 billion in cuts to the mass aid program. So I don't know what the what the actual, um, number of billions of dollars are invested into the state program, but that's a that's a yeah.

01:48:42,100	S1:
I don't know if I, I was kind of referencing to Dylan if he had thoughts on that.

01:48:47,601	S30:
So the funding that we have for the climate latest program, this has already been obligated through fiscal 2027. Um, that is through the alternative compliance payments. Those are payments that fossil fuel generator power generators, um, made within the state after FY 27. Because obviously that's uh, that soon we will be, um, funding, we will be funding our climate leaders program under the umbrella of our communities program, which we get payments through the Regional Greenhouse Gas Initiative, which is a multi-state compact. To reduce carbon emissions, it's basically a carbon cap and trade program. And, um, while I cannot comment on, um, pending legislation that's coming through the House, we have been part of Reggie for many, many years now, and it will continue to fund the green communities and the green communities, plus family to work.

01:49:46,501	S1:
Okay. Thank you.

01:49:50,067	S2:
Um.

01:49:51,067	S1:
I guess. Yeah.

01:49:51,667	S5:
Um.

01:49:52,501	S1:
And what about just the demand on the grid? Like, if everybody. Like, all in, like, would we have an issue?

01:49:58,901	S30:
That's a really good question. The way that we've designed the both the stretch and the specialized energy codes. Is, um. Well, let me let me first say that obviously both codes do encourage, um, electrification. That's a good. Um, that's not going to be such a burden on the grid because they're designed to minimize the incremental demand from space heating. Um, I've had comments about, you know, different mandates about, um, EVs and demand growth from other areas. And that's all true. The way that we're designing the grid, the way that we're designing the stretched and specialized energy codes, is to make sure that all energy demand is occurring off peak periods, because it doesn't technically matter that energy electricity use is increasing, it's about when it's increasing. And if we can encourage and design buildings so that they're using electricity off peak times, then it's not going to impact the grid as much. And in fact, National Grid is designing time of use grids. It's already, um, created rates to encourage charging for electric vehicles, off peak periods. And those specialized codes really crush, um, space heating demands. So adopting the specialized code is actually a grid friendly measure in Doe autopay.

01:51:31,467	S29:
Okay.

01:51:33,167	S2:
That's it.

01:51:34,267	S1:
Go ahead. No, I was just gonna, like, see if there's anything else also sensitive to Vicki's time. But if you have something direct on that, this is your business.

01:51:45,767	S2:
I guess the other question is this step change doesn't affect any of our municipal buildings at all. Really just opens up the opportunity to access grants for municipal buildings and schools. So they're the beneficiary, but they're not subject to it. I guess that's the main issue there when it comes to the town.

01:52:06,000	S3:
Is that is that correct?

01:52:07,667	S29:
Is that.

01:52:07,968	S3:
Correct? That it.

01:52:08,868	S29:
Won't affect.

01:52:10,901	S3:
Municipal buildings? I guess I'm because, uh, chapter 23 does address commercial buildings, are we not? Would the municipal building not be considered under the commercial?

01:52:27,868	S30:
It is a multiple buildings are considered under commercial. So it would affect any new municipal construction of the public.

01:52:34,267	S3:
So? So it would. Okay. Okay.

01:52:37,100	S5:
Thank you. In fact, this if we build a new building.

01:52:38,767	S1:
If we build a new building.

01:52:41,000	S2:
Any of those capital plan changes?

01:52:44,000	S1:
We're not putting an Adu off of the town hall or anything.

01:52:47,767	S5:
I'm not proposing any new buildings.

01:52:49,367	S2:
If you want to move to town, Joe.

01:52:51,367	S5:
I said, I want to put the town hall, and I don't want to do any more new building for a while. I don't know.

01:52:55,100	S29:
All right.

01:52:56,000	S2:
So, like, are there similar thresholds associated with this? You know, if we did some sort of a consolidation in 10 or 15 years. But I mean, that's long, long grass out in the long grass stuff. So I mean, we haven't dug into that at all.

01:53:13,868	S5:
Jeff also passes.

01:53:14,868	S29:
And.

01:53:15,567	S5:
Wants to be recognized. Public comment.

01:53:18,200	S2:
Dylan are there similar thresholds? Sorry around this? You know, we said 4000ft² for single family residential, um, for municipal buildings. Is it a similar kind of rubric or is it what are we looking at there?

01:53:35,968	S17:
Um, to weigh it up. the Commercial Code treats building size.

01:53:41,000	S30:
I don't believe that there are any.

01:53:43,100	S29:
Thresholds.

01:53:44,167	S30:
With regard to different levels of regulations. Um, they treat solar differently. It's um, it's like a minimum wattage, uh, square, but of, of the roof space. Um, the only threshold that exists in the commercial, uh, building code is with multi-family buildings, because multi-family residential buildings, for one reason or the other, is in the residential and commercial code. Um, so if a multifamily building is bigger than 12,000ft², that falls under the commercial code, that would be, um, possible standards. But if we're talking about like a generic office space, uh, municipal building, then that's slightly more uniform.

01:54:35,067	S2:
Okay. Yeah, I remember that from your presentation now from a couple months ago. Thank you. All right. Okay.

01:54:41,901	S1:
Um, yeah, let's let's, uh, go with, uh, Jeff online, and we'll close up with you and go right to.

01:54:47,501	S29:
You.

01:54:47,667	S1:
Vicky.

01:54:49,467	S29:
Uh, hello, everyone.

01:54:50,400	S15:
Jeff Allsop.

01:54:51,400	S14:
Uh.

01:54:51,667	S15:
11 Blackrock.

01:54:52,601	S14:
Road and 587 Bay road.

01:54:56,300	S15:
Um.

01:54:57,501	S9:
You know, there's.

01:54:58,000	S14:
A lot of sheriffs in town and one is rich. And I agree with Rich's point of view on this. You know, we have we have, um, uniform building codes and, and the town has adopted the structure code, and it's been very successful. Um, we we are a, you know, green builders, uh, we, we build to a higher standard than stretch. Um, but we are not particularly interested in Passivhaus. Um, we we're interested in contextual architecture and buildings that look like, um, belong in anything. So, you know, I think I think in this case, we're adding a lot of ambiguity. Um, you know, I had a conversation with Emma. I, I don't agree with chasing grants. And in spite of, um, good, good policy, you know, grants come and go. We don't know whether coming and go. There's probably a lot of other opportunities to get solar on our high school. I supported school solar. I have it on my buildings. Um, but I would say that that when you get into passive House for multifamily, the stress code is, is, is already capable of producing amazingly efficient buildings. So when you add passive House, which is, uh, limits the amount of, uh, operable windows, um, you know, there's there's a certain consideration that you have to do to me? Passive house. So now you have another show. You've got our you've got our our building inspector. We've got state codes. We have you know, we have stretch codes. And now we're talking about specialized codes. I don't think we know enough about this. I don't think we know about enough about what would be changed, and then we would be responsible for withdrawing something. It's really hard to. It's really hard to back out into something once you've already got in place. I don't think we're there. I think I think the town deserves more information. I think there needs to be more shakeout on, on, you know, energy supplies, sources, all these things. I think it's a bad idea and I support not supporting it. Going on the warrant, if it goes on, the Warren would really encourage you not to support it, Because if it goes down to work, you have to give an opinion.

01:57:33,000	S26:
Yep.

01:57:34,501	S14:
So at this point, how can you give an opinion? It's it's so premature.

01:57:41,100	S1:
Thank you. Okay. Anything else to add from your seat, sir?

01:57:45,367	S28:
None.

01:57:46,000	S1:
All right. Vicky. Anything you'd like to add to the discussion? Uh.

01:57:51,200	S28:
You want the tip?

01:57:52,701	S21:
Thanks, Fred. Thanks. Um, I would just add, um, my role has just been really connecting the dots between this program, between some of the big capital projects going in town, the rooftop at the high school. Um, and I just think this is a really unique opportunity to fold these programs together and really get a good project at the high school. Um, you know, in the immediate future. Um, so I would say that, um, you know, if we could fund that solar through this grant, and I know, I understand people who aren't for chasing grants because they feel like you're paying somewhere else for the grant money that you're getting. Um, but if we could pay for that solar array with grant funding, then that is all savings that the school is going to get. That could offset some of that capital that you're asking the voters for. So to me, this makes the roof project a lot more palatable. And I don't even live in town. So I can't speak as a taxpayer. But if I was a taxpayer, that's how I would be looking at it. Um, so that's that's only common.

01:58:59,601	S1:
And that has time commitments to for the school project. Just that for approval would be required at this town meeting this April to get into a funding program that would help with that. And that grant would save us roughly a quarter of a million a year, is what I heard or read.

01:59:15,567	S21:
Yeah. I mean, considering current electric rates and electric rates are.

01:59:18,767	S1:
Only going.

01:59:19,667	S29:
Up. Yeah.

01:59:20,501	S21:
Yeah.

01:59:21,300	S5:
Okay.

01:59:21,868	S21:
Yeah.

01:59:22,501	S2:
This is hard.

01:59:23,100	S3:
Can I make two comments here?

01:59:25,467	S1:
Yeah. Let's let's, uh, any questions for Vicky across the board. Go ahead. Uh.

01:59:29,367	S29:
Rosie.

01:59:30,000	S3:
So. So first comment is, I think it's important that we continually reinforce that any grant potential is not guaranteed. We get in line like every other community and we apply for it. Mhm. So I think that's something that we need to make very clear. Second thing is to get on an email. You talked about an alternative to this particular grant where you said there was another program where we could investigate, um, and probably get some solar. You didn't you didn't, um, elaborate on that, but I wonder if you could just, uh, tell us a little bit about that. Just in a nutshell. I mean, I guess what I'm trying to say is there are other ways. First of all, it's not guaranteed. And secondly, you had talked about another program. So could you just get very quickly review how we would do that?

02:00:30,067	S21:
Sure. So an alternate way to Darcy Dale had asked me another, is there any other way to get solar on the roof of the high school? And I said, yeah, of course you can do it the way we did it at the Hamilton Wenham Library, which is third party financed. So a solar company comes in. They basically lease your roof. They own and operate the solar array. They sell you all the power they generate and you get in return credits on your electric bills. So that's how it works at the library. So yes, you can build solar that way. And a lot of times they market it as budget neutral or a little bit of savings. But if you can own the array, which we would do through a grant, own the whole thing, then you own all the savings and all the power that that array generates. So it's just more lucrative for the town to own it, if that makes sense.

02:01:20,567	S2:
If we were to apply the, you know, for its 250,000 if we own the solar, if you use like the library model, is it? You know, it's at 250. Is it? Is it 100 like or is it like $25,000 of savings? Like I'm trying to understand, like the order of magnitude difference between us owning it outright versus getting a cut of of savings? I know it probably changes a lot, but it's not like.

02:01:45,267	S21:
There's different ways to format it. Sometimes it's just a fixed number of pennies off of retail, which it is at the landfill. So for every kilowatt hour that that landfill solar produces, we get $0.02 of savings. If you own it, you get 100%.

02:02:02,767	S2:
So $0.02 on what's the standard rate these days 17 $0.18.

02:02:08,467	S29:
A month or not.

02:02:09,067	S21:
Now for supply. Yeah, 15. It's just the supply because you're still going to pay distribution. Yes. So 15 I think is what Hamilton's paying now.

02:02:20,767	S5:
Did we used help financing to do the solar rooftop on the DPW garage, which will power the high school. I mean, we'll power the town hall.

02:02:28,567	S21:
And we're going to own that array. Yeah, we're going to own it. We do.

02:02:31,467	S5:
Own it. We could look for we could look to do a tilt. We could ask the school district to look to do a tell on, uh, rooftop solar on the high school. Then as a potential as another, as a second alternative.

02:02:42,701	S2:
What is that? Sorry.

02:02:43,901	S5:
So it's a tax exempt lease purchase. So it's another third party program, but it costs it. It's arranged differently than what we did with the high school, with the library group. So it's another way to.

02:02:56,467	S21:
Yeah, I don't know a lot about that.

02:03:02,267	S21:
But there's definitely other ways to build it. It's just about what generates the most savings for the town.

02:03:07,167	S29:
I mean.

02:03:08,067	S1:
I think I read the program through this specialized code would save about 83 or 85% of the the bill. Like, can you equate a percent of the bill if we leased it that we would save.

02:03:20,000	S21:
Well.

02:03:20,167	S1:
That's.

02:03:20,267	S21:
How much. If we built out the whole solar on the roof, that's the percent of the total electric use that the solar would would satisfy. Right. Um. Oh. So. But you're asking for the dollar amount.

02:03:31,601	S1:
Yeah. Just curious to to identify the savings between lease versus own. So basically you said $0.02 and then I got and I got a dollar amount on the other one.

02:03:41,000	S21:
But yeah I guess we'd have to I have to get deeper into lease versus on.

02:03:46,767	S29:
Yeah.

02:03:47,467	S1:
Okay. Rosie, did you have anything else or was that that as far as alternative ways to do it or.

02:03:56,167	S3:
You know, it just we have to do sort of risk, you know, our cost benefit analysis. And I think we cannot be guaranteed a grant and we should really not be facing, um, this, this one project on what it would cost to the town collectively to do something like this. To. To enroll in a specialized code, especially where we've heard Rich talk about so many uncertainties. I, I, I'm just not sure. You know, just my comments are sincere. I believe in, in, uh, clean energy. Green energy. I, I just need to look at the other side of it, the cost. And so that's what I really struggle with. And as Rich has pointed out, he's our town expert. Right on on building codes and and adherence to codes. And he himself told us it's perplexing. I look at the statue, I believe it's, uh, 25 a that the specialized code, the, the, the building codes come under and already since 2023, since this Was um. Since this went through its inception, there have been 64, at least 64 section changes and amendments. It's it's not a settled code. And I wonder what the future would bring, because we are obligated to adhere to any future amendments. I worry about that. And while I certainly agree that the, um, stretch code has proven very, very helpful, we need to think about the costs of going forward realistically.

02:05:55,400	S29:
Okay.

02:05:56,467	S1:
Any other Tom or Ben?

02:06:01,968	S1:
Questions of Vicki or. Overall.

02:06:04,868	S2:
I have no more questions, but I think we should deliberate as a board so we can let someone go who needs to go.

02:06:10,667	S1:
Hey, why don't we, uh. Why do we do that? Um, a lot of good discussion. Vicky. Yeah. Thank you. Vicky.

02:06:18,267	S2:
Thank you. Dylan. Thank you. Rachel. Thank you.

02:06:20,767	S29:
Thank you. Thank you.

02:06:21,868	S1:
Yeah. Um, so we heard a lot. We asked questions of last week. I think, you know, people came back. You know, I kind of, in some ways fault the state for the on the kind of spot we're in and the clarity of how this is managed and stuff. But I but I struggle a bit between our role of putting it on the warrant and letting citizens decide versus our responsibility of making sure we understand and have vetted and put something on the warrant, you know, versus really like what, Bill Wilson vote for it. Um, and right now, we're not asking if Bill Wilson would vote for it or Ben or Rosie or or Tom where we're saying, you know, the town has previously voted, you know, for us to move on this initiative, we put a the the environmental committee together. They've done their work. Kudos to the work that you've done. You've brought us brought it back to this body, this governing body to, you know, with all the information, um, that we asked for. And now we're kind of weigh in the pros and cons of with what they brought me not questioning what you brought us as much, but is that ready? And do we put it in front of the townspeople who asked for this and prior votes and allow them to vote at it, vote for it, and then in a future meeting, will vote whether we are in favor or not. Right. That's where we're at. So that's kind of where, where I, where I kind of I know last week I was pretty vocal about this and kind of leaning not ready, not ready. You know, just asking questions. I think I've gotten a lot of those questions answered. And I'm kind of leaning right now relative to that. You know, we've got to get it's probably time to bring it to the town and to say what we want to say, what we don't know, to say what we know and let them let them opine on this and to vote. That's kind of where I'm sitting right now, but interested in hearing what you know, the rest of the board has to say.

02:08:06,367	S5:
Can I just ask for a motion to include this on the warrant or not?

02:08:10,400	S1:
Should we start with that?

02:08:11,567	S5:
Start with the motion so you can have a discussion.

02:08:13,567	S1:
Okay. Can I get a motion for the April town meeting warrant on the inclusion of specialized stretch code?

02:08:25,367	S2:
So.

02:08:27,000	S1:
So we have them moved by Ben. Can I get a second?

02:08:32,367	S29:
Second.

02:08:33,300	S1:
Seconded by Tom. So very interested to hear where the rest of the board is at. You know, kind of relative to. Is it ready for town? Time to talk about this. Tell the town where we're at. Tell them what we don't know. Tell them what we know and let them opine. Or does this thing need to take longer?

02:08:52,167	S1:
Why don't we start with Rosie?

02:08:55,100	S3:
Rosie? Kennedy. Nay.

02:08:56,567	S1:
No. No further discussion. We're not ready to vote any. I think you just did just discuss, you know, your points relative to the confusion, the, you know, our inspector's comments and such. So I don't want to, like, just have you reiterate what you just said. But, you know, I just want to do a round robin here on any further comment from Tom. Ben, you and I. So I think you've you've said your piece, it sounds like. Okay. Tom.

02:09:27,167	S1:
Tom Meyers, any other further comments thoughts? Where are you.

02:09:30,501	S29:
At? I'll, I'll jump.

02:09:31,667	S30:
In and chat.

02:09:32,501	S15:
Um, I think first of all, I think it was super helpful that everyone sort of weighed in on this, and it really gave me a lot of knowledge on this perspective. And I, you know, I've been supportive of the hike giving this.

02:09:43,400	S29:
Forward for.

02:09:44,267	S15:
A while now. And, um, you know, I, I have mixed feelings on it as well. Right. So I think, you know, we made some good points around sort of the and, you know, listening to, you know, the building sector and rich um, around sort of the changes in the law and sort of the uncertainty. Um, I definitely think that's something to, to factor in. Um, but, you know, from what I'm hearing so far from last week's presentation on some of the impacts to today. You know, it sounds like there's definitely an impact on, you know, on the building community, right. For instance, you know, there's going to be compliance with codes that need to in that sort of uncertainty. I think there's some, you know, cost impact on new construction. And I know the the comment last week was, you know, on a, you know, a $2 million house, it might look like, you know, 10 to.

02:10:33,968	S29:
$12,000, you.

02:10:34,567	S15:
Know, to come to compliance with this, this.

02:10:37,000	S29:
Code.

02:10:38,567	S15:
Here today, uh, you know, it's, you know, certain ADUs may or may not be impacted and, you know, impacting renovations over a thousand. Um, it sounds like I'm trying to grasp my head around what is the actual impact to the, you know, everyday taxpayer. It sounds like it is a select group that are going to really need, you know, be filling this in the pocket when they're building a new construction or doing a substantial renovation. So it's I mean, I don't know the numbers on how many renovations we have in Hamilton and how often that occurs, and maybe we need that number, but it sounds like last week it was, you know, 4 to 5 new houses that that are being developed. So it seems like at least what I'm hearing, the impact is some cost to, to, you know, um, taxpayers that are building new windows and renovations. There's also an impact of the building community to try and, you know, wrap their head around these different regulations and comply with I'm sure that's a hassle and a lot of work and, um, and money that goes towards their, their perspective. Um, so I understand some of that impact and maybe I'm missing some things, but at the end of the day, I think those can be dealt with and we can, you know, get through those. And I think there is some substantial benefits here. And I look at, you know, I don't think that, you know, environmental grants and green grants are going away anytime soon. I think there's motivation, especially in that, you know, where we live, you know. You know, highlighting environmental awareness and being green and carbon neutral. And I think that's been a huge initiative of our town. And we voted for it. Um, to sort of, you know, reduce our carbon footprint. And I don't see it as chasing grants. I see it as, you know, trying to get more funding to a town that has a very limited supply of funding. I mean, we've talked about this so many different times that 97% of our, you know, funding for our town comes from the taxpayer and through property taxes. And we don't have any other commercial tax base. We don't have any other, you know, revenue streams to sort of support the initiatives. And now we're faced with, you know, an override and a debt exclusion. And every time a proposal comes to this board where we have an opportunity for cost savings or for new revenue, whether it's selling a tower, whether it's, you know, you know, moving regional, whether it's whatever it is, there's always opposition to moving in that direction. Yet we are constantly being reminded that taxes are going up and our taxes are high. Yet every time we try and pursue something that's going to get us more funding, we are met with, you know, fear and, you know, and you know, what could that possibly be? And let's keep Hamilton the way it is. So in my opinion, is $1 million is a substantial amount of money that we could be, you know, um, the recipient of and it could benefit our schools. It could help us in the near future with our tax rate, with our, you know, with, you know, maybe not having a debt exclusion, you know, in the next couple of years, maybe not having to ask for an override. So I think as a small community that has a high tax rate, that has very limited commercial base, we have to do everything we can to try and chase that.

02:13:52,100	S29:
Kind of thing.

02:13:53,100	S15:
Um, and so I would be supportive.

02:13:55,367	S29:
Of not only doing this on the.

02:13:57,100	S15:
Warrant, but I'd be supportive of the Select.

02:13:58,901	S29:
Board voted in favor of it. Abraham.

02:14:01,667	S1:
Okay. Tom. Ben.

02:14:04,000	S2:
I think that was very well said. Um, there's not a lot to add to it other than to say I agree with most of what Tom said. I just kind of want to echo a couple of key points. Um, as far as the citizens and taxpayers go, it, you know, it's kind of a looking forward thing. And as it's currently structured, um, you know, it's going to affect a small handful of people who may potentially move to this town. I think in the very first, um, conversation we had with Dylan, I really appreciated him coming tonight because it reminded me we talked about the, um, the multifamily project that's already been built in town for the passive House standard. You know that. So it kind of shows that developers can get up to that level, even in, in larger buildings that are slightly more complicated than a single family one. Um, you know, I've had the benefit of seeing, you know, some of these houses get built and they are typically built to a higher quality standard, and it does tend to reduce energy costs. Right. So even though they might be paying a little bit more, um, if it's $12,000 or if they did this additional due diligence with our special electrical inspector that said it could be up to 30,000. Um, you know, they're probably going to be saving that back just in through their energy bills, right? By going to this, this next level and this next tier. Um, I've seen it in practice time and time again. Once you achieve these higher quality standards of construction around especially air tightness and where the leaks occur, you know, I know that it is nice to have certain aesthetics when it comes to windows and sizes. Um, however, this the stuff pays for itself when it's done right and it's done, um, to this new high standard. So I see it as It's difficult because it's complex, and I understand that there's more professionals that are then needed to, you know, get through these certifications. But given that there's been such a move in this direction, if they had a more cost effective or simpler way to ensure that buildings could always be built to this same high quality through prescriptive measures, they I think they would have done it by now. Right. And a lot of that stuff, we see things come in prescriptive like LED lights, like that's an easy thing to specify when it comes to the fabric of the building and the whole home performance. It's just not as easy to get there. And so it ends up being complicated because the physics are complicated. Um, the construction techniques are and but there are ways to get there. And that's the thing that's left. You know, the heat pumps are getting more efficient. Solar panels are getting more efficient. The water heaters are more efficient, the lights are more efficient. There's the only thing that's left is the building fabric. You know. So I'm. I was glad to hear that. You know, people can still get propane generators. As my parents have up in Maine. They lose power a lot more than we do down here. Um, and they're out in the boonies, so they've got a giant propane tank and generator, a whole house. Um, they have more stories there about the kind of their energy efficiency journey, but, um, happy to share those, too, because they've been the beneficiary of a lot of these types of practices. So I, I look at it from this chair of thinking about, well, what's in the best financial interest of of the town from a financial perspective? I'm weighted towards, you know. Rosenberg. Good point. The cost benefit I, I look at it as we have a great track record of achieving these grants. You know, I appreciate the one pager. We've gotten $1.8 million in grants from the Green Communities Fund. And it's like if we had if we'd had a terrible track record at getting grant money, I'd say, well, this maybe it's a, you know, a bit of a lark, but the fact that we have that track record, you keep betting on yourself, right? So I think, you know, there's always the ability to repeal it as my understanding, which would be probably a painful process to go through if we had to through a special town meeting or something of that effect, even if it wasn't isolated, because there's some emergency, we have to repeal it immediately because there's some uplift and it's going to cost us millions instead of potentially getting a million. That's where I sit with it. It's just we've got a track record. It's affecting a small handful of taxpayers the way it's currently structured. Um, I don't think I can reasonably stand against it. Um, and say that that's in the best financial health when it comes to the town's operations. So, I mean, I'm in favor of it. It's kind of where I've landed. But I get it. I understand the complexity of it. I can't deny that it's the complexity is real.

02:18:52,601	S1:
Well said. Um, as I started to say earlier, you know, I struggle a bit on, you know, whether I would vote for it versus like, have we brought this to a point where we with voters had previously, previously asked us to look into this, this initiative? We've set goals for our community. They've gone out. They've done their homework. They've brought it back to us. Yes. It's complex. Is it clear? Not even close. And will it change? Could it evolve to favor us or disfavor us? Likely they'll be change. We just talked about a change two months ago. Um, and that scares me a bit. But I also look at the project that lies ahead of us. To me, that's the the school roof. And I do think we talked a little bit and touched on lease versus zone. I do think this is the best path of potential savings for, uh, for the school on their operating budget, on the cost of, of their annual electric bill and our only chance to get that. And there's a time constraint on that when I've already put it on the warrant. Right. If we don't I don't think that it doesn't happen. Right. So we don't we take one vote off the board right away. Is that fair of us with a regional district? Not to. To be in that discussion and allow our citizens to have input as well. Um.

02:20:00,000	S9:
Comment to that, though, that actually the grant money is the town's to decide how you want to spend it. We're suggesting that the school so Wenham can get it.

02:20:08,667	S1:
Oh they can. Okay, so I didn't know if it was like a regional vote were there. Okay. Forget it. No.

02:20:13,367	S29:
Okay.

02:20:14,167	S1:
Um.

02:20:15,167	S9:
But it would be a shame that.

02:20:16,767	S29:
Yeah.

02:20:18,067	S1:
So. So, um. I'm not as. As on board with, uh, the, you know, Tom and Ben on. You know, like, I'm in favor of it. I'm not here to tell you if I'm in favor of it right now. Right now, I probably I probably wouldn't. Um, but I am in favor of putting it on the warrant and allowing our community to talk about it. So that's where I'm landing right now. I was putting on the warrant, and let's have a discussion in front of the entire town and get feedback.

02:20:44,200	S4:
Is it okay to say that?

02:20:46,000	S1:
Sure.

02:20:47,000	S4:
I'd just like to address one topic that has come up repeatedly this complexity thing. These codes evolve with time. They the code which is left. But he's constantly going to classes to learn about the newest code. It has technology changes and economics change. The codes are morphing through time. So I don't think it's any more complex than what he's what he's doing already. Okay. There's a little tweak to it. Yeah, he's got to learn some, you know, 4000 foot and so forth. But it really isn't anything different than what he's really doing already. I think he's got a philosophical issue going on, but the complexity really isn't there. I wish Dylan was still with us to speak to complexity, but I don't think it's that complex.

02:21:30,367	S1:
Let's let's we we're already past. We deliberated. I think we're probably at a point to go around and vote on this just with respect to time, I, I always love feedback to a fault, probably, but, uh, but I appreciate everybody's, uh, let's go around now, Rosie. We'll go back to your How do you vote on this? For the warrant? To put it on the included in the warrant.

02:21:51,601	S3:
Rosie Kennedy. Nay.

02:21:53,501	S1:
Tom.

02:21:55,467	S15:
Tom Myers I.

02:21:56,767	S1:
Ben.

02:21:57,467	S2:
Ben Kaluza I.

02:21:58,567	S1:
And Bill Wells and I. So that passes 3 to 1.

02:22:01,501	S29:
That goes on the one. Okay.

02:22:03,501	S1:
Uh, Bill didn't join us. Correct.

02:22:05,100	S29:
Oh, okay.

02:22:06,601	S1:
Okay. Um, so we have other items on here. I think, um, in respect to time, you know, we talked a lot last week about the sale of the patent homestead, right? We talked about, you know, some of the deed issues that we had. And then I guess we ended the and ended the discussion around. Yeah. Okay. So is it okay just to put it on there and give the town the right to negotiate at this point? So I don't know if we need further discussion on it. Um, or if we need to vote these all individually or if or, or we can hit them one by one if that's the case. But from a sale of patent homestead any.

02:22:37,801	S5:
Can I make a recommendation in the interest of time? Yeah, because we're losing our audience. So I think most of the people that were here were here for that. That's exactly what happened. So you have a warrant. A draft warrant in front of you that's got all the articles you need. You need to remove the citizen's petition question.

02:22:55,901	S29:
No.

02:22:56,467	S5:
I think that you could probably. You could probably talk to Tom and see if there's anything that he wants to make you aware of. Okay. About any of these other bulleted items. And if there's not, you could probably vote to close it as is. All these things are currently.

02:23:09,400	S1:
I'm good with that. I didn't know if you laid them out separately for that reason. These these.

02:23:12,868	S29:
Five. Three, six. Look at that.

02:23:18,267	S20:
So that was one of the ones that I had. We included a placeholder, um, that Joe had indicated that maybe the possibility of that one. Okay. That one.

02:23:27,968	S5:
That's not going to read.

02:23:28,868	S29:
All right.

02:23:29,467	S1:
Anything else Tom you want to call out on?

02:23:31,367	S20:
So, um.

02:23:36,801	S20:
The probably the I guess the biggest articles are obviously the, the annual budget, which that article is the same as it is every year. Article 2-4 is the supplemental budget which is being funded contingent upon an override question passing. So that's how it was structured. There's many different options in terms of how you want to structure these types of, um, votes. That's probably the simplest way to do it, frankly. To have one article where you're funding your town and school budgets, and then a separate article with the supplemental budgets for each that is contingent upon the passage of the override question. But, um, you know, there are other ways to do it. But when I talked to Joe, we felt that that was probably the easiest way to handle it in terms of both, um, you know, for the townsfolk and taxpayers to understand.

02:24:39,667	S1:
I think we've discussed that as a board, and everyone was in agreement with that structure.

02:24:43,367	S5:
I provided my guidance based on the feedback.

02:24:45,801	S29:
Yeah, exactly.

02:24:46,667	S1:
So I'm good with that. I don't know if we were taught. We talked earlier about the spread of the 1.3. Is that in here?

02:24:51,767	S5:
And well, we'll we'll add that.

02:24:53,467	S1:
Okay.

02:24:53,868	S5:
We'll add all that, uh, definition. But it's, it's in here to be able to say how much. And then we also have the, uh, the brief summary that explain what's what. In that.

02:25:04,200	S20:
So okay, um, article 2-5 is the capital article. And, um, we may need to revise the way it's drafted, depending upon whether or not there's any borrowing or lease purchases.

02:25:17,267	S5:
When there are no lease purchases in the capital article, as we're proposing it right now. Right.

02:25:22,067	S17:
Correct.

02:25:23,267	S29:
Yeah.

02:25:24,868	S20:
Any borrowing?

02:25:26,167	S5:
No borrowing?

02:25:26,767	S29:
No.

02:25:27,067	S17:
Nothing that we're aware of right now.

02:25:28,567	S29:
Okay. Thank you.

02:25:39,167	S20:
Um, the only, uh. I'm sorry. Which one's wrong?

02:25:45,167	S29:
That's the roof.

02:25:47,567	S20:
Okay, two dash 12. Um, that's the school roof project. So the school, the regional school district committee approved a and, um, motion, the ballot question and a warrant article, which is based on the MSBA standard form, what you need to use in order to have your projects funded through MSBA. We've revised this a little bit, um, so that it includes essentially some of the language that would otherwise be just included in the motion. Okay. More in the in is a in the interest of transparency. Um, for example, the MSBA standard warrant article does not include any language whatsoever with respect to the debt exclusion. We think it's better to include it in the question. It also, the standard warrant article does not include anything about the reimbursement. And we think that that's also important to include in the warrant so that when people are looking at the warrant, they know that a that this is going to be the cost of the project, it's going to be subject to a debt exclusion vote, and that the MSBA has approved a reimbursement amount, in this case of 45.52%.

02:27:07,767	S29:
You.

02:27:08,367	S20:
It's a standard article. We've done the same thing with um, with most I think MSBA articles that we include almost.

02:27:17,000	S1:
Has the school seen this view or is this.

02:27:19,868	S28:
What.

02:27:20,567	S5:
We haven't shown it to the school.

02:27:21,667	S1:
Yeah. I don't foresee any issue.

02:27:23,400	S25:
No this shouldn't be.

02:27:24,400	S20:
It's the same. It literally just takes a little bit of language that's in the motion and.

02:27:29,167	S1:
Puts it.

02:27:29,467	S20:
Into the into the water nautical. So, um.

02:27:32,000	S5:
It's I assume that since copy law also represents when we do, we'll be making the same recommendations for you. And you did. And they accepted.

02:27:39,100	S20:
I don't know where they are, frankly, in terms of the warrant.

02:27:42,100	S5:
So I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Warren didn't let them.

02:27:45,000	S20:
Yeah, I haven't seen. I did take a look today, actually, before I came up to see if we had a saved version on the system, and I did not see the updated version, so. But I'm sure that Lauren has been in contact with one of them.

02:27:59,100	S5:
Again, we're just closing the warrant. We're not. If you're going to play with the language a little bit here and there between the now and the time we print it. So I think we're safe to accept Tom's language. We have to make sure we're going to. But we're.

02:28:12,000	S2:
Removing the.

02:28:13,767	S1:
Petitions.

02:28:15,167	S5:
So I have I have here a draft motion for you to remove article three, dash six and 5-1. Right. That's the position one and I. And then close the warrant as okay.

02:28:26,100	S20:
Provide it. And then so articles um three one is the sale of the portion of the patent homestead three two and three three are the leases of the landfill former landfill property for use as a gun club slash shooting range. Those are all staying on the warrant.

02:28:46,367	S5:
Yes. Okay. And then the prudent investment rule. Okay.

02:28:49,167	S20:
That's saying as well.

02:28:50,067	S5:
Okay, great. Okay. With that now.

02:28:52,000	S1:
Yeah. Definitely the investment rule. I don't know if there was further discussion on the leases. I think we had a good discussion, but I think I'm I'm good with that and the homestead stuff as well.

02:29:00,167	S20:
Okay. So I'll take three six and five one off.

02:29:04,000	S29:
Okay. After the vote after that.

02:29:07,067	S1:
And the only comment I made initially around the debt exclusion being way towards the end. I know you have it with capital, I guess I don't know, but I just feel like it flows and I know we don't. We can talk ordering later. Right. But I don't know. I don't know if it made more sense to put it.

02:29:21,167	S29:
In the talk order.

02:29:22,100	S20:
But sure, it's up to you. It's really up to the board.

02:29:25,100	S1:
Yeah, I don't know. It just feels a little bit disjointed to me relative to just the expenses required from the town's from an operating and a capital. I think the back to back with the schools would be, to me, kind of a more of a, you know, two chapters of a story, but sure. But we can talk about.

02:29:42,701	S29:
That, right? I don't know.

02:29:43,801	S20:
I will say that the, the typically articles 26272829

02:29:53,300	S20:
and.

02:29:56,200	S20:
210 and 211 oh oh. Now, um, not the, the um, the stabilization funds are not because those are two thirds vote, but the other ones are usually included as part of the consent agenda.

02:30:08,200	S29:
Okay.

02:30:11,801	S20:
So they're kind of closer.

02:30:13,701	S1:
Yeah, exactly. If they were on the consent for sure. Yeah. I wasn't thinking that. Yeah. You're right.

02:30:19,868	S31:
Okay. With those, um, those changes. Um.

02:30:23,868	S1:
I'm okay with, uh, you know, closing the Warren at this point with, uh, the articles as outlined and written.

02:30:29,601	S29:
Right.

02:30:30,167	S20:
Last one last comment I had was that I know that in, uh, that there have been some discussions about potential amendments to the regional school district agreement as well.

02:30:40,901	S5:
I don't think, you know, I don't think that we're at the point to have that conversation.

02:30:44,567	S20:
Okay.

02:30:44,901	S5:
That's fine. We're too far away still.

02:30:47,067	S1:
And the water bill.

02:30:49,100	S5:
When I'm there in the state, they're feeling the same way. And there's I do not believe there's any, um. They close the one. I don't believe they have it.

02:30:55,467	S20:
They did not include.

02:30:56,100	S5:
It.

02:30:56,267	S20:
Either. Okay. Yeah, I wasn't sure if they had.

02:30:57,868	S5:
We may we may choose to provide an update to town meeting about them, but. Right.

02:31:03,100	S29:
Yeah.

02:31:05,167	S1:
Yeah. In a report or something. And then I didn't know as well if like, were we going to try to impact the water rates in some way or is that already locked and loaded in the like from our earlier discussion on rates. That's after.

02:31:18,200	S29:
Again.

02:31:18,567	S5:
That the water rates decision is the Select board's decision. It's not.

02:31:21,467	S29:
A decision.

02:31:22,567	S5:
Okay. So again we can we can provide updates to town meetings. It's a good place to get people's attention and let them know things that are coming. Or we could provide the one page that we're going to put in the tax bills and the water bills into the, you know, as a handout as well. But we can do a lot of different things.

02:31:37,968	S1:
But yeah.

02:31:38,567	S29:
Okay.

02:31:40,300	S5:
We don't have the time meeting.

02:31:41,367	S1:
That's right. I just was reading the language and it talks about okay. You're right.

02:31:44,868	S29:
You're right. I think.

02:31:45,667	S5:
Beth and Jeff Ossoff has his.

02:31:47,767	S29:
Race. Okay.

02:31:48,567	S1:
I think Beth, you were first here and then.

02:31:51,100	S32:
Yeah. I just have a question on.

02:31:53,267	S6:
Article.

02:31:53,767	S32:
Two eight.

02:31:55,300	S12:
Um.

02:31:57,200	S32:
Is the meal tax always gone all back to the HTC? Was that is that part of is that in an agreement or something or what is.

02:32:05,567	S28:
It.

02:32:05,767	S5:
Was it was used as um, the carrot in getting Tammy to vote for it initially. So when the town first adopted it, it was decided at that point that they would do it to help fund the HTC.

02:32:17,000	S32:
So if I went back to when it was originally voted in, it would say that that sales tax is for HTC.

02:32:23,567	S5:
I don't know if it would say in the question, but the question was presented to timing voters. This is what we would do with.

02:32:30,667	S32:
It, okay. So if it's not in the town warrant, then there's a question of maybe it could be used a different way.

02:32:36,767	S5:
There's always a question that could maybe be used a different way because.

02:32:39,501	S32:
I don't know. I'm just curious about that.

02:32:41,667	S5:
Just to clarify what one town meeting can't impose its will on a future town meeting. So just because the town.

02:32:46,767	S29:
In one.

02:32:47,100	S5:
Way, that doesn't mean that a future time, it can't change their mind. However, the board you know, we've had many conversations with.

02:32:53,767	S29:
No, I was just curious about it.

02:32:55,267	S5:
Seven years that I've been here and it's always been decided to to leave it with the HTC. In fact, the town worked with the HTC and the finance committee last year to come up with a new process for making sure we were giving them the right amount. And that's what.

02:33:08,467	S29:
How.

02:33:08,567	S32:
Much income are we talking? Do you know how much.

02:33:11,000	S6:
Will we.

02:33:11,667	S32:
Um, income we get from the meals.

02:33:13,200	S29:
Tax?

02:33:13,567	S14:
It's like 75,000.

02:33:15,367	S26:
Okay.

02:33:16,868	S32:
Thanks, John. If I came to the income.

02:33:19,667	S29:
In full.

02:33:20,067	S5:
Transparency, it's a lot more than.

02:33:21,467	S29:
That. Yeah, it was, it was it was a.

02:33:23,501	S5:
It was a large there was a large one time disbursement from the state. We've asked the state several times. Wendy's asked. Just got mad at his ass from the HTC because we were just concerned because it was such a big.

02:33:37,000	S32:
And what was that change?

02:33:38,400	S5:
What was the number one D this time?

02:33:39,767	S29:
It's 107.

02:33:40,667	S17:
I believe the total is going to be about 174,000.

02:33:43,567	S29:
Okay.

02:33:44,000	S5:
But that's so about one more than usual. Yeah okay. But the state has said it's a one time disbursement to kind of true up. They they may have made another error at some point. And now they're trying to make it right.

02:33:55,367	S32:
But and it's so the finance other financials available from the HTC because they make their own decision on how that money is used. Correct. They do they have full control just like the school committee has.

02:34:06,567	S29:
Yep.

02:34:06,868	S32:
Yep okay. So somewhere I could find that. Great.

02:34:11,801	S29:
Yep yep. Jeff. Also Jeff super.

02:34:15,801	S14:
Quick. Hi, guys. Um, did you have any further clarity on whether we, um, for the leases? What? What the, um. The time, the terms of the lease, activities for a town meeting, um, presentation, and also for the requirement of another RFP. Since we had gone through a.

02:34:39,000	S29:
Lot of maintenance. What?

02:34:40,901	S14:
We really need to do that again.

02:34:42,667	S29:
Yeah.

02:34:43,367	S5:
So Jeff's point is that the miles of tracks just went through an RFP process when they got this, uh, renewed six years ago. They're wondering if they need to go through the RFP process again. We already believe the hamlet to one of our gun club does need to, because it's been so long since an RFP was done for that section. Right. Tom was the one that recommended the RFP process and everything else that we discussed at last Wednesday's meeting. I'll let Tom explain.

02:35:06,267	S20:
Sure. Yeah. Thanks, Joe. Um, yes. And in my opinion, it is required. So the last time that this went out to bid, there was a, uh, RFP was solicited for a five year lease term, um, which is now expiring. So the RFP did not include if it included a 20 year lease term back then, then, and that's what was awarded then you would not have to go out for an RFP. In fact, you probably wouldn't need a town meeting vote right now either. But because it was a short term lease last time around, it, um, you know, the terms of that RFP have been satisfied, and there's no ability to just renew the lease without going through an RFP process.

02:35:51,100	S2:
It's a requirement.

02:35:52,367	S20:
Yeah. Generalized chapter 30 B, section 16.

02:35:55,868	S2:
Um, can't put like options in.

02:35:57,968	S20:
Correct? Well, you can, but once you know, if it was done in the original procurement procurement, you could have certainly done that. But, um, that wasn't at the time. There was a policy decision made not to do that. But once you get to it really goes by dollar value. So it's $35,000 for real estate and it's the value, it's not necessarily what they pay in rent is what the value of that property would be. And the longer the lease term, the more likely you're going to obviously exceed the $35,000 threshold.

02:36:30,167	S5:
So we're going to also try to get an appraisal of those two plots as they sit with all of their wards and see what that is, to try to help us discuss what the value is. Gotcha.

02:36:41,501	S29:
Right.

02:36:42,167	S14:
So it would be a completely new RFP after. So you get you get to your town meeting to vote and and to negotiate the leases.

02:36:50,901	S29:
Yeah.

02:36:51,667	S14:
And then the RFP is where does it stand in the process?

02:36:56,701	S29:
Well, we'll.

02:36:57,868	S5:
We'll start asking. I'll start asking Cape Law to draft two RFPs, one for each parcel, subject to some terms that we'll outline. We have to get an appraisal done. So we have at least an idea of true value. But we don't have to hit value if we get a response. If we only get one response, for instance, and it's less, we can choose to take it if it's the least. Well, we'll get that stuff done in this period now. So we should be able to release the RFP very shortly after town meeting. Assuming that town meeting votes to approve the term.

02:37:30,067	S1:
Would we want to do that even if they don't? Would we want an appraisal on this or we would.

02:37:34,467	S5:
We can do the appraisal thing again. Like I said, the properties are both very kind of.

02:37:39,868	S29:
Yeah, not.

02:37:40,267	S5:
Conflicted.

02:37:41,367	S29:
But um.

02:37:43,367	S14:
I'm kind of wondering, do do.

02:37:45,367	S29:
We.

02:37:46,100	S14:
You can actually renew a lease for three years without town meeting.

02:37:51,067	S5:
We we can, but your request is yours. And the gun club's request has been for 20 so that you can make investments.

02:37:56,868	S1:
Long.

02:37:57,000	S29:
Term.

02:37:57,167	S5:
Planning and long term planning. That's why we're here, looking at the options.

02:38:01,267	S29:
Right.

02:38:01,968	S14:
But. But could we not also renew for three years?

02:38:06,767	S20:
We'd have to look at it again. It's going to depend upon the value.

02:38:10,000	S29:
Let me have a council take.

02:38:11,467	S5:
Let me have council take a look at it Jeff, and we'll get back to you on that. But that's kind of subject for that's that kind of separate from this decision to whether or not to ask that notion.

02:38:21,267	S14:
If you could actually rule these for three years without the town meeting. I know you wanted to coordinate our two leases, which I'm fine with.

02:38:29,167	S29:
I think you know that.

02:38:31,100	S14:
But, you know, if we're able to actually, do, you know, secure the secure lease for three years without town meeting, it would be interesting to us to do that, certainly while pursuing a longer term.

02:38:43,367	S5:
So I'll have Tom looking at the legal question for you in the meantime. Let's see if we can get these onto the warrant, and then I can talk to the board about about what they prefer to do long term. I do think that if we're going to commit one piece of property for 20 years, we may as well have them both committed and subject to similar terms, so that if something comes up in 15 years that we want to talk to you about, or you want to talk to us about, there's there'll be options for all that in there. But I don't I think we could look at both things at the same time, but it'll really be up to the board once they're granted the authority. It'd be up to the board to decide whether they wanted to go with a longer term or shorter term.

02:39:19,400	S14:
And we would prefer long term. I'm just I'm just throwing it out. There's sort of the nuance here. You know, if, uh, you know, we get if we if we're able to secure, you know, short term, be secure, that's always an option.

02:39:35,467	S2:
Sorry. I got kind of I got lost for a second. Is the main concern about an open RFP? Is that what, um.

02:39:43,367	S5:
Is that what.

02:39:43,767	S2:
You're.

02:39:43,868	S5:
Concerned about is the open RFP process, Jeff?

02:39:45,968	S29:
I mean, yeah, yeah.

02:39:46,968	S14:
More so. I mean.

02:39:48,000	S29:
We.

02:39:48,767	S14:
Put in a lot of money and a lot of, you know, a lot of manpower, and we've improved the site. We've done a huge amount of work. So it would be an interesting issue for us that an RFP goes out.

02:40:03,167	S2:
Somebody else comes in and offers more money, and then we have to look at.

02:40:06,267	S29:
Risk.

02:40:06,667	S1:
Of.

02:40:06,801	S29:
It. Yeah.

02:40:07,801	S2:
So just, uh, from my like, small brain cells, just so I understand it. So then our question to Tom from Cape Law is okay. Like let's say we go through this process at town hall. It gets approved. It gives us the authority to basically structure a 20 year lease agreement, but we'd have to go out to RFP. The question that we have to, Tom, is if we don't select that option, can we just extend it by three years? If the rod and Gun Club decide that they don't want to take that risk of going out to an open RFP?

02:40:41,701	S20:
Take a look at it. My I can say my inclination is no, but I can.

02:40:47,000	S2:
Say is no, we cannot legally.

02:40:48,667	S20:
Correct. Yes, but but we will take a look into it for sure. There's other options. You can enter the license agreement. A license agreement is not subject to bidding, but license by definition, must be revocable at will by either party.

02:41:03,267	S5:
The other thing I'd say is that, you know, the, uh, the vote here is actually that town meeting to authorize you.

02:41:10,267	S29:
To.

02:41:12,000	S5:
To a 20 year term lease for a gun club. So the RFP is going to be for people who operate gun clubs. There aren't going to be a whole lot of respondents.

02:41:21,901	S20:
Yeah, really there's fairly limited uses you can make of that. It's a it's a closed landfill.

02:41:27,467	S5:
Right. So I think.

02:41:28,167	S28:
I.

02:41:28,267	S5:
Think there's just concern of being outbid for a piece of property that they've improved over the last six years. Yeah. While I understand it, it's not like there's a huge number of, you know, shotgun clubs out there looking to, um, to get, you know, four acres in the town of Hamilton. So.

02:41:45,100	S1:
But you're not appraising it as a gun club?

02:41:47,667	S5:
No, we didn't praise it for the use because we're asking specifically if you can, if you'll be authorized to do a 20 year lease for the gun club use. So we will appraise it for that.

02:41:57,167	S1:
Okay. So thanks.

02:41:58,167	S29:
Okay.

02:41:58,467	S1:
Sure. All right. I'm good with.

02:41:59,467	S29:
That. Yeah. Okay. All right. Okay.

02:42:02,300	S14:
Thank you for.

02:42:03,667	S1:
Yeah. Thanks, Jeff.

02:42:04,467	S29:
Yeah.

02:42:05,100	S1:
I think the only other thing we didn't talk about, and I'm pretty good to to close this, but was there any more update on the patent homestead, or is it similar that we're just looking for the ability to negotiate? We still have some some things to learn along the way. Or have you learned something since last?

02:42:20,000	S29:
Our discussion was just five days ago.

02:42:21,567	S5:
I haven't had.

02:42:22,968	S29:
The time to look at all we've discussed. Yeah, that's exactly what we saw last Wednesday.

02:42:27,868	S5:
I'm just trying to see if we if we want to keep this on. And then.

02:42:31,100	S29:
I.

02:42:31,400	S1:
Would I would say we keep that on and close. The one that would be in favor of that.

02:42:36,100	S29:
All right. Okay.

02:42:36,701	S2:
So I'll make a motion to close the warrant. I have to read the date and all that.

02:42:42,467	S5:
We close the warrant for annual town meeting April 11th. But, um.

02:42:46,701	S2:
With the removal of articles three six and five one.

02:42:51,400	S29:
Yeah.

02:42:54,567	S2:
And as Joe filled in on the date and time. Yeah.

02:42:59,901	S1:
So we have a first, a second. Uh, any further discussion? Otherwise I'll entertain, uh, do a roll call, starting with Rosie.

02:43:08,901	S3:
Rosy candy. Hi.

02:43:11,801	S29:
Everybody.

02:43:12,801	S2:
Ben. Ben.

02:43:13,801	S1:
I and Bill Wilson. Hi.

02:43:15,801	S29:
Okay. Hello.

02:43:18,801	S1:
Uh, Tim referenced this next item earlier. Uh, as you know, we all know, unfortunately, uh, Jay Butler, who was an amazing person and volunteer for our community, passed, I think, on February 12th. Um, we had some discussions about, um, dedicating the town hall, the town hall edition in honor of Jay with all the work and contributions he did for that program without it and his role with the CPC. You know, we could not have funded that program. Um, so any further discussion on that? I think, um, if everybody's in agreement, which I think we were in the last, uh, the last meeting, you know, we can take a vote on that. Uh, but first, I'll entertain any discussion. Well, I'll take a motion, first of all. So, Ben, since you're in the room, I'll look to.

02:44:03,467	S5:
You.

02:44:04,000	S2:
Uh, motion to Recommend that we name the Town Hall edition in honor of Joseph J. Butler.

02:44:15,000	S1:
Until we have a first, we have a second. Further discussion. Comments.

02:44:19,367	S3:
No, I just think it's a great idea and a nice. It's a very fitting honor for Jerry.

02:44:24,801	S5:
I agree. Yeah.

02:44:26,100	S15:
Same here. 100% supportive.

02:44:28,167	S5:
We're going to do.

02:44:30,667	S1:
100% support here. So let's take a vote. Rosie.

02:44:34,501	S3:
Rosie Kennedy I.

02:44:36,868	S15:
Know my son.

02:44:38,000	S2:
Ben Kaluza a.

02:44:38,868	S5:
And.

02:44:39,100	S1:
Bill Wilson, an enthusiastic.

02:44:40,767	S5:
I. Okay. I'll give you a little background on this latest item. Um, the review and approval letter to the planning board regarding the proposed cell tower behind the public safety building. If you remember, last year, a year and a half ago, um, I was, I.

02:44:55,501	S4:
Guess it was last.

02:44:56,000	S5:
Year. The planning board was hearing a request, uh, on site plan review for the antique fire department building. Uh, I antique fire thing here. And, um, because technically, the fire department didn't own the land. You needed to provide a letter, uh, supporting the fire department representing the town's interest at that site. Plan review. We now are going to have a site plan review coming up for, uh, the the second cell tower behind the public Safety building. The cell phone tower company does not own the land. The town does its planning director and is asking for you to provide similar type of letter, acknowledging that the bidder, infrastructure partners is authorized to go before the planning board due to the fact that they have won the right to, uh, develop that tower, as we have been asking. And they are the ones that are going to have the requisite information to share with the planning board about that tower.

02:45:52,367	S1:
So through the special permitting process, they would go through.

02:45:55,100	S28:
The.

02:45:55,667	S5:
Special permit process for cell tower development. And that includes site plan review. So the letter there is a draft I can make changes to it, but that's pretty much the same kind of letter you said last year.

02:46:07,167	S1:
Yeah, it looks straightforward to me.

02:46:10,767	S2:
Yeah, I think it's, you know, urgent and important, you know, to help shepherd this along. Um, you know, so we increase our ability to kind of generate some revenue as we do the last tower, and then a potential windfall if if somebody decides to buy it out. You know, that was a huge positive for the town. It was, um, I think, you know, it's a much better deal for us than having a bunch of little, little towers sprinkled around town, a little concerned about that and digging into this. So I think the sooner that we can help shepherd this through, the better.

02:46:42,200	S1:
Absolutely. And that versus the same company that built the one behind, uh, town hall. So they're a known entity and they've been through the process. So. Mhm. So yeah. So I'll, uh, take a motion. Do we need to vote on this? Yeah. Uh, to approve uh, the letter that's drafted and in your, uh, in your package from our chair, Bill Olson, to the planning board for the proposed cell tower behind the Public Safety building.

02:47:07,067	S2:
So moved.

02:47:08,667	S1:
Second. Okay, we got a second with Tom. Starting with you. Rosie.

02:47:13,167	S3:
Rosie. Kennedy, I.

02:47:14,367	S1:
Tom.

02:47:14,901	S15:
Tom.

02:47:15,901	S2:
Ben.

02:47:16,367	S1:
Ben glatzer and Bill Wilson, I.

02:47:18,300	S26:
Yeah.

02:47:19,901	S1:
We're at that point of new business. We got a lot of business going on. A couple things interested me tonight that the potential. Yeah. We're good.

02:47:25,667	S27:
Thank you. Okay.

02:47:26,701	S1:
Great. I didn't realize how close or not we were on the, uh. Regional district agreement. So that should be an item I think we bring up. I didn't know that was even potentially a topic for this. This, uh, at this stage, we just.

02:47:41,968	S5:
Just, like, about a week and a half. Two weeks ago, less than two weeks ago. We got an updated version of Red line version of the district agreement, as drafted by Lauren Goldberg of Cape Law on behalf of the two towns, Hamilton and Wenham. I think they're still needs to be a little bit more discussion and, uh, you know, among that, among that group of people that are meeting to review it, and then we can bring it back to everybody. I hadn't got changes from, uh, Tom or Bill Olsen, who have both been made aware of the draft. So once we get some changes, I'll try to schedule the next meeting so we can go over it with them. But it did not seem like one of them was interested in moving on that at this point in time. Right now either.

02:48:25,200	S1:
Okay. We'll just keep that on the.

02:48:26,267	S32:
Radar and get a copy of that red line version.

02:48:28,367	S5:
Yeah, it's I mean, it's still in development, so it's not really we're not sure what's going to change. So I don't think it's ready for public scrutiny yet.

02:48:37,167	S32:
It's just that if we did public records request, we could get it.

02:48:40,467	S5:
When I think I think when it's I'm not sure I'll have to run it by the town council.

02:48:47,267	S15:
Yeah, it's.

02:48:48,367	S5:
It's policy development. It's not it's not done yet. So when we have something that we want everybody to vote on that will be public.

02:48:54,667	S2:
We haven't seen it.

02:48:55,467	S1:
Yeah, it'll come to us.

02:48:56,367	S11:
And I'm curious to see where we're at and what's what stage is.

02:49:01,167	S26:
Yeah. Yeah, great.

02:49:02,267	S11:
Cause it's like, sometimes you're like, we got into late. We didn't, you know, we got into early. I'm like, where are we in the process?

02:49:08,968	S1:
Yeah. I'm curious what's just edits in here? We've been making.

02:49:11,767	S5:
Some progress through like October. And then kind of it became really difficult. People were being pulled in different directions for budgets and stuff, and so it just didn't get very.

02:49:22,667	S11:
I think it's too much anyway for people to digest.

02:49:24,901	S27:
Yeah.

02:49:25,467	S1:
Well, you can make the next motion, then.

02:49:28,767	S2:
Make a motion to adjourn. Uh, March 2nd meeting.

02:49:33,300	S1:
All right. Can I get a second?

02:49:35,100	S26:
Your point earlier about Rosie.

02:49:37,567	S5:
Okay.

02:49:38,767	S1:
Uh, let's do a roll call. Vote to adjourn. Rosie.

02:49:42,868	S3:
Rosie Kennedy, Clive Meyers.

02:49:45,167	S1:
I tend.

02:49:46,367	S2:
To lose the.

02:49:46,767	S1:
Eye and tell us. And I thank you, everybody. It is 1006.

02:49:52,701	S17:
Good night.

02:49:53,300	S31:
Good night.

02:49:54,000	S26:
Thank you.