00:00:00,230	S1:
Yeah.

00:00:01,129	S2:
All right. I see we have a quorum. It is 702. I'll call to order this meeting of the Hamilton Select Board. Uh, so, as usual, we'll open up with announcements and board openings. I know, uh, um, I'll just go through that. Let's forget the joke. Um, affordable Housing Trust has one opening. Uh, Conservation Commission has two openings. Uh, the Council of Aging has one associate opening. A cultural council has one opening. Uh, the community preservation committee has one opening for a member of historic district commission. Uh, the historic district commission has two openings for three year terms. Two openings for two year terms. One must be a resident of the historic district and one must be a resident realtor. Uh, and also, the Human Rights Commission has one at large openings.

00:00:56,630	S3:
Actually, through the openings of the Cultural Council came up to a place Yeah.

00:00:59,399	S2:
That was no different. Just a quick correction. Historic district, uh, Commission has three, uh, three year terms.

00:01:07,299	S3:
Cultural council.

00:01:08,599	S2:
Oh. All right, well, you got it. Yeah. All right.

00:01:12,099	S4:
Um, all the all the openings are posted online.

00:01:14,530	S3:
Okay.

00:01:15,469	S2:
All right. This is a time of our agenda. We will have, uh, public comment, um, three minutes for something that is not currently on the agenda. Do we have anybody who would wish to come to the podium for public comment? Please do.

00:01:35,799	S5:
Hello, I'm Emmett Holt to Manor Hill Road, Hamilton.

00:01:40,329	S2:
Emmett, hi.

00:01:41,170	S3:
How are you?

00:01:41,969	S5:
I wanted to come, uh, I'm part of the environmental impact committee for the town and what we want. I saw that on your agenda tonight is, uh, Warren articles to discuss for next town meeting and, uh, our committee is sort of rushing, and we wanted to get this to you. We would like to recommend to the Board of Selectmen to adopt the, um, specialized energy code, in which I have a letter here that can be handed out. Joe, I gave you a copy. I don't know what's the best approach, but I'll just.

00:02:18,599	S2:
Yeah, I'll.

00:02:18,969	S3:
Take.

00:02:20,300	S5:
The letter right there, which is.

00:02:21,800	S3:
Summarized. I have one, but.

00:02:24,270	S5:
The key what we wrote the request tonight is that we get put on next week's agenda to discuss this. Uh, the important part for the town is, is what this does. If we approve this, it's a very small change into the zoning laws. What it is, it really only affects totally new construction. Um, and it's a it's a very small cost item, but what it does, is it it enables Hamilton to apply to be a climate leader town. And once you're a climate leader town, there are only 40 of them. You have access to further grant money for improving facilities and where the town is looking at putting in, you know, upgrading, doing whatever to the school system. Something's got to happen where the boilers blown on the middle school and high school. Something's going to happen. And the rec schools. So this is really to enable us as a town to get in a better position, to get more grant funding to fund those things, just like we did for the town hall. So really, that's.

00:03:25,000	S2:
Why you mentioned schools. Would this work on a regional district or would one of them have to?

00:03:30,000	S5:
We're working with the with the town of went there. Weren't there our equivalent in Wenham to do the same? Okay.

Yeah. 00:03:37,870	S3:
So we did just.

00:03:39,669	S4:
In full disclosure, we did put a placeholder for this article on the list of articles that'll be discussed later tonight. And we've sought the opinion of the building commissioner, as we would with any recommendation to make a changes to the building code. So I've asked the building inspector prior to the next meeting to have a list of pros and cons about the special energy code for to be considered, so.

00:04:01,669	S6:
Commercial and residential. Yeah, it has to be both is not one or the other.

00:04:05,530	S4:
Okay, well, you mostly have residential here anyway, so, um, but.

00:04:09,599	S5:
It only affects.

00:04:10,400	S4:
Me. I believe it has to be, you know, applied to both.

00:04:13,599	S6:
Yeah.

00:04:14,270	S1:
Yeah.

00:04:14,770	S5:
And I'm going to attend the meeting. They asked me to join them on Thursday, too.

00:04:19,600	S2:
So it sounds like it's on our list. And it's something that is potentially on the docket in two weeks or our next meeting.

00:04:24,800	S4:
Yep. Yeah. Next meeting. Next meeting is actually March 10th, not March 3rd.

So. 00:04:27,569	S1:
All right.

00:04:30,170	S4:
Um, it's a it's an energy code. It's a, it's a building code thing. It can be adopted by town meeting. Select board can sponsor it onto the warrant and then it gets discussed. So yeah.

00:04:39,600	S6:
But it's a warrant.

00:04:40,730	S4:
It's not into the zoning bylaw. It's it's into the building code.

00:04:44,129	S7:
It's a building code.

00:04:45,800	S2:
Yeah. But we'll go through all that.

00:04:49,029	S1:
Thank you. Thank you.

00:04:52,670	S8:
I just have a quick question. Is, um. Uh. Sorry. Beth Herr, um, 270 Asbury Street, and I am talking as a private citizen. Um. Oh, my goodness, I don't even know what's happening around music. Woo! We're having a party. Um, are we going to be discussing or will I be able to share about the unfunded mandate, or is now the right time for that?

00:05:18,069	S2:
Um, it's not on the agenda. I don't know if it's going to get brought up in any reports. We did see some other communities and stuff. So I think our next step will probably be have another meeting, probably executive session to go through that. But I don't see a problem with your comments.

00:05:33,370	S8:
Okay. I was just going to um.

00:05:35,300	S6:
Yeah, yeah.

00:05:36,100	S2:
As a public comment.

00:05:37,300	S8:
Right. As a public comment. Um, hold on.

Sorry. 00:05:41,629	S9:
In June. Is that on the agenda for today?

00:05:45,899	S4:
I think it'll.

00:05:47,600	S2:
In light of this, it'll likely be tabled. Okay. Even a date.

So. 00:05:51,329	S8:
Okay. Yeah. So I just wanted to share because I did send you all a couple different, um, letters with different information. So three towns had asked for a determination on an unfunded mandate. That's, um, there's the ability with proposition two and a half that you can ask for the division of local mandates to make a determination on whether something's an unfunded mandate. Just for a little background for people who haven't read what I wrote. Um, so three towns did that, and they just came back on Friday stating that these are unfunded mandates. Um, three A is an unfunded mandate. And, um, but they didn't come back with the fiscal impact. They needed more time to gather more information. So I know I had mentioned this before. Um, I just want to come back again and really encourage the select board to do this. We already know it's an unfunded mandate, but the thing that I think is really important is when we give them input and send a letter to them, they will come back and tell us what they believe the fiscal impact would be on Hamilton, which would be a nice jumping off point for John McGrath and the fin com to have some things. Um, I also sent Middleboro request, which actually had a nice delineation of how they came up with their numbers. Uh, they have 1400 units they're supposed to build, and they say there's about 600 million. So more than half a billion in upfront costs, one time upfront cost and 22, about 22 million would be the yearly cost. So that's what they're thinking. Obviously they haven't heard back from the state if they agree or where they're going to go. So I had just asked that we would request a determination, wait for that information with the financial impact. Um, discuss the next steps because there's three next steps. You can go to your legislators. You can, have ten citizens do a class action suit, or you can go to like, I think it's a superior court and get a determination exemption. Based on what? Based on the state coming back saying it's unfunded mandate, it's not automatic that we're exempted. So I think that's important that we make sure we understand that. Um, and then I just ask that you guys would consider adjusting the timeline accordingly because we won't have all that information. And then meanwhile, that Marlborough, um, letter that they had submitted to the state auditor, um, did have some good information. So I think for us to be working behind the scenes, um, to figure out financial and other impacts of three a so, um, yeah, I just appreciate your consideration. I know it's a lot, um, a lot of towns are working on trying to figure this out, and this was a new bit of information that really kind of changed things up, I think a little bit. I do believe there's two other towns I know. Two other towns got determinations. I'm not sure what their submissions look looked like, so if that would be helpful, I could do a little more research for you guys. But I just figured giving you that stuff would help you at least have it in hand and not have to search.

00:09:02,870	S6:
I appreciate you speaking up, and obviously our town council already is working on this. I just want to let you know that. Oh, perfect. It's already been it's already being worked on in the background. But wait, we appreciate all your input and keeping us.

00:09:13,100	S8:
Well, sometimes you just don't know. And I didn't want you to have to like, search for it. So I tried to send you as much as I could.

00:09:18,769	S6:
And we'll get it on. We'll get it on agenda soon. So thank you for bringing it to our attention.

00:09:21,730	S8:
Thank you.

00:09:23,000	S2:
So we'll talk about dates for that as an executive session.

00:09:25,730	S6:
Like I just want to give a conference a town that we're already working on this in the background.

00:09:29,000	S2:
Yeah. How to seek an opinion from the state auditors have been discussions were going through.

00:09:32,370	S4:
So a member of the public on zoom that would like to have the hand raised.

00:09:35,870	S9:
Have you decided.

00:09:36,529	S10:
That you're going to seek or are you still have.

00:09:38,129	S6:
We got to talk? We're going to talk about it tonight.

00:09:40,370	S4:
They won't be able to make a determination till they meet on it. So they have to have it on agenda. They have to talk to town council.

00:09:44,799	S1:
I understand that.

Yeah. 00:09:46,399	S2:
Yeah. We're working with town council on that.

00:09:49,230	S4:
Erin Crowley of.

Okay. 00:09:52,629	S11:
Hi. Just a quick comment. Erin Crowley I live on Appaloosa Lane in Hamilton. And just because three came up, I just wanted to also weigh in and just say, I'm really grateful for this committee to be moving forward with the planning process for it. I know you probably don't hear from those of us as much, and that's why I'm speaking up, but I am someone who is very much in support of Hamilton being coming compliant with three a. I know that we need more multifamily housing in this town, and that rezoning to allow for that is really imperative. Um, and I believe it will cost us if we don't do this cost us, and who's able to live in our community and in many other ways. So just wanted to weigh in. I know it's not on the agenda tonight, but since it was brought up as somebody who is really grateful for you all, for moving forward in it and who is a vocal supporter of the requirement to rezone for more multifamily housing.

00:10:44,570	S4:
We also have Lauren Lynch in the public on on zoom.

00:10:47,399	S2:
Did you have another comment or was that her comment?

00:10:49,200	S4:
I thought that was her comment. I think Lauren Lynch.

00:10:51,200	S2:
I thought she said since that was mentioned.

Okay. 00:10:55,629	S12:
Thanks everyone. Yeah, I'll just piggyback off of that as well actually. Lauren Lynch at 62 Willow Street in Hamilton. Um, also would like to just publicly voice my support for the three day passage and kind of our town proactively coming into compliance with it. I think it's a necessity for us to put forth a plan that we see as most suitable for our town. Um, agreeing with what Erin noted, I think it's a real need that we have in our town. Um, and I think there are some real advantages to being thoughtful about how we continue to develop the town by looking at ways to increase the kind of density. And again, a very thoughtful and Hamilton directed way. So thank you.

00:11:32,000	S2:
Thank you. Lauren. Anyone else? Anybody else in the room?

00:11:39,330	S2:
Okay. Moving on to board. And town manager reports. Um. Any updates? Tom. Bill.

Rosemary. 00:11:48,870	S1:
I'll give a quick update on the the work with utilities. So Joe and I have been joining some meetings with UTL and some members of the planning Board on the efforts of the form based code. Uh, so we've met a couple times now. Util is putting together, uh, some recommendations on the form based code strategy and specifically with the compliance with three. A so looking at, you know, as many of you know, there is a percentage that needs to be allocated to the downtown area as well as another percentage elsewhere in town. So we are looking at what that map will look like around the downtown area and what areas that will include sort of what the specific zoning will look like within the downtown area. Uh, and then also looking at other options within the area, other aspects of town. Um, so one area that we're looking at, if we look at the Gordon Conwell, may require some additional help from the state with as far as some of the requirements that we're going to be, some of the regulations that are impacted, we may have to get we had submitted a public comment to try and get some of that modified so that we could potentially include that zone as well. Um, I know that was part of the public comment that we had submitted to the state, and I know you feel and Joe and other folks had met with the, uh, the state HLC, uh, prior to that meeting, just to kind of give our feedback around Hamilton and, you know, what we're looking to accomplish here. And it sounded like they were potentially agreeable, um, to, to that, that modification. So, uh, things are moving along. Obviously, you know, we'll continue, as Bill and Joe mentioned, with the the unfunded mandate, continue pursuing that on a separate angle. But as far as the util work, we're continuing forward with that and putting together some recommendations. So it's moving along.

00:13:25,730	S4:
Can I can I have one thing to that. Yeah. Go ahead. So also the town is also commented during the public comment period that ended last Friday on the on the proposed regulations for three a we submitted quite a lengthy letter with with input from the chair of the planning board and some of the members of the select board and as well as town council. So we submitted quite a lengthy letter making recommendations both for things that we think should be changed in the regulations or modified or flexibilities that the that HLC should offer. Um, and with a particular aim at looking at ways to try to reduce the unit count in communities that are infrastructure challenged. So those are the the main high points we will be posting. I meant to have the letter posted to the website today. I will get it up there tomorrow.

00:14:12,970	S2:
So that letter will be.

00:14:14,269	S4:
We'll have it. We'll have it online tomorrow okay.

00:14:18,600	S2:
Where will they find that? Just is there a section?

00:14:20,899	S4:
Well, we'll make it easy to find. It'll be on the landing page. There'll be a link to it.

00:14:24,070	S2:
Okay. Perfect. Tom. Bill. Anything in your world for tonight? Oh.

00:14:31,799	S6:
So.

00:14:32,929	S2:
Rosie? Yeah. Are you waiting at the gate?

00:14:35,529	S13:
Yep. Few things. Um, CoA meeting on the 5th of February. The, um, board and Teresa, the director, are very happy that, uh, the plans to, um, do some minor renovations to the outside painting. Um, re asphalt walkway and doing the wall are very exciting to everybody involved with the CoA. On the eighth, I went to the town hall tour. Um, was very is very interesting to see everything. And it was amazing to see that the bones, the um, structurally that the town hall in the ground is very stable. Um, they're planning to be on time and on budget. They've had no change orders so far. And, um, the plan is, uh, Around next spring or so, maybe April or so. Things will be opened and ready to go. Um, and this CBA meeting on the fifth, also, there's a discussion about the Adu bylaws. Very interesting. They had some good suggestions, which they sent off to the planning board on the 12th. I attended the HDC um, meeting. It was my first time going. It was very interesting meeting. We talked um, they talked about the pocket park on the corner of railroad and Bay road down near where the bank is, and they've put about $150,000 into that. And they're moving forward into, um, getting some plans done. And the owner is working with the HDC about that. Um, and she sees contributed significantly to the form based code and are looking to follow up with the town regarding plans for specifically the form based code. Uh, on the 12th, I also went to a regional school agreement meeting with the superintendents school committee chair, the Hamilton Pinkham chair, the Finn Finn director, um Windham, um, a town administrator. And our finance director is very interesting talking about a tripartite agreement. And how do you get everybody to agree? I think for a long time we felt that the, um, regional agreement needs to be reopened and, um, have some have more transparency and accountability in terms of, um, where the funding is allocated. And hopefully those meetings will continue to into fruition of an updated, um, regional agreement. And that's.

00:17:27,799	S9:
All.

00:17:28,470	S6:
I wanted to clarify one thing. Um, I talked with Joe as well. So although we have no change orders, we have contingency money. So we have contingency spends, but no change order spends, right? Joe, just wanted to clarify this. There's been no change order to date, but we're spending contingency money.

00:17:42,170	S4:
Yeah, there's no there's there was a minor change to structurally some of what they wanted to do in the second floor, but it's it's within scope and it's within budget. So you're both right. We've made a minor adjustment with the contingency small things.

00:17:55,569	S6:
But within the, within the within the budget.

00:17:57,730	S4:
We we also had something positive happen in that the there was quite a bit of money set aside in the project to sister the the the beams in the second floor. And now that they've been able to open it up and look at it, they no longer believe they have to do that. So we'll save some money there, which will help us if we run into something that overruns on. So right now it's all still positive.

00:18:16,329	S6:
Perfect.

00:18:17,200	S14:
Thank you.

00:18:17,529	S1:
Thank you Bill, just one more update because I was just on the, uh, the school building committee meeting prior to this. So there's a few events coming up around the school. The school projects. So I know tomorrow night there is a kindergartener, Cutler. Um, orientation for new parents. There's going to be. I know Superintendent Tracy said. There's going to be some flyers and material available for those parents, but then there's a whole bunch of other events coming up in the next couple of weeks. So I know on Wednesday there's a community forum at the Hamilton Windham High School. Uh, March 1st, there's a Cutler School open house in Q and A on March 5th, they have an elementary parent forum, uh, where they're going to be a day in the life, um, where they actually put together a nice video that's going to walk through the how the students will kind of enter the classroom and what the classroom will look like and what the, you know, the learning areas will look like. So there's a, you know, a nice video that kind of shows, uh, the, the what the school will look like. And there's some cost and budget analysis as part of that video as well. Um, March 15th is another Cutler School Open Q&A. And then March 20th is another day in the live video at Cutler. So just keep an eye out for those dates. There'll be a good opportunity to engage with the consultants and get some more information on the project.

00:19:28,430	S2:
Yeah. Excellent. Did you mention the February 26th meeting for the.

00:19:31,900	S1:
Yeah. Yeah. Yes. That's Wednesday. Yep. That's the community forum.

00:19:34,630	S2:
Got it. I just want to make sure I was looking at those dates.

Um. 00:19:37,130	S1:
Yep.

00:19:38,369	S2:
Did you have something else? I know you chimed in on Tom's. Were there any updates from you?

00:19:43,869	S15:
No, I think we're good right now.

00:19:46,430	S2:
All right. I think we covered everything I wanted to. I know you, the regional school district meeting. Thank you for attending that. The projects for the schools. Um, HTC actually, we didn't have our last meeting. Uh, that got rescheduled. Um.

Uh. 00:20:05,829	S2:
The Hamilton Development Corp.. You didn't. You went to that meeting. That meeting. Okay. Um. Um. Okay. I met the CPC group on that one, so. Sorry. All right, so we'll move to the consent agenda. I see two items. One is the approval of our minutes from the 29th. I'm sorry, February 3rd. And the other is a request for the annual melody Miles five K road race on the 29th. Can I get a motion for that? Or does anybody want to remove any items from the consent agenda?

00:20:38,599	S13:
I move, we approve the consent agenda.

00:20:41,369	S6:
Second.

00:20:42,799	S2:
All in favor?

00:20:43,930	S14:
Aye aye aye.

00:20:45,130	S2:
Okay. That consent agenda is approved. All right. Getting into our main agenda. First up, I see we have Tim in the room. And, uh, Joe, uh, if you recall, a couple of weeks back, we discussed a water abatement on Bridge Street, and we had asked for some more information to come back. So let's continue that previous discussion.

00:21:05,700	S6:
Tim is here.

00:21:07,069	S2:
Tim. Joe, who's going to drive?

00:21:08,700	S4:
I think, Tim, because I was woefully inadequate in this role last night.

00:21:15,470	S2:
So I think we're trying to understand what was done. You know, what the typical values are and where we're at in this.

00:21:19,869	S16:
Tim Olson, DPW director. I also have the property owner, Mark Durgin, in the audience as well. So if there's any specific questions you'd like to have him answer, uh. He's here. Um, so it was pretty much a, um, standard abatement, uh, request, uh, based on a service leak that happened. Um, once the bills were received, it was evident that there was a large leak. Uh, large use. Uh, we contacted the owner. We went out, we investigated the issue. We were able to determine the leak. And the day after, uh, the leak was repaired by the owner. Uh, it was a substantial bill that was paid in full by the owner. Uh, so we are not. It's not accruing any interest on this, um, figuring this would take a little bit of time to work through, uh, but based on our current abatement policy, I'm only allowed to grant up to $500, and this is substantially more. I think it's based on our quarterly reading that if there's a leak that happens, there could be a few months of use until the next reading is taken. And that's when it's there's evidence that there is a leak going on. So there was substantial time, I believe, that the owner was not aware of the leak happening. And as soon as that leak was determined, uh, he acted immediately, uh, with our help and our assistance and repaired the leak.

00:22:59,029	S13:
Excuse me. Joe, there's no audio on this.

00:23:02,000	S2:
Oh, is that why we did have a raise?

00:23:03,869	S15:
I can't repeat all that.

So. 00:23:06,930	S6:
Tim, can you type that into the chat, please?

00:23:16,599	S17:
I cannot get.

00:23:19,700	S15:
How does it feel now?

00:23:23,000	S13:
Can people hear.

00:23:24,930	S4:
Somebody? Want to put a thumbs up?

00:23:28,000	S15:
There we go. All right. Thanks, John.

00:23:31,900	S2:
So is an unknown leak, right? Became aware of it through a quarterly billing. I see the abatement amount 5007 to 7. Was the bill like, ten grand, though? Um, so how'd you come up with the five? Seven. Two.

Seven. 00:23:43,000	S16:
So that's our standard abatement calculations. You take the average of the last three similar quarters to get a kind of a normal use. And then, you know, you subtract out the normal use and divide the difference. Um, I think the first I believe the first page in the abatement has the calculations. Um, how I typically calculate my abatement.

00:24:04,500	S15:
Okay.

00:24:06,930	S2:
And have we had other of this size?

00:24:10,269	S16:
Not recently. No. know, um, we've had a couple other abatements come through, but they've been relatively minor. This is one that probably went on for quite some time. It was a service to an outbuilding. Um, that was probably, um, you know, active for a while. And then once it was determined and the leak was found, we were able to isolate the leak. And then the resident then paid for, uh, repairs the next day.

00:24:43,430	S17:
So I'm sorry. I'm having trouble pulling up my agenda to do it. So he's looking for $5,000.

00:24:53,569	S16:
So typically, like I said, the way that we've calculated the abatements up until when we revised the policy in 2022. Yeah. Uh, that would be it's usually about half of the of the bill up to. And it was up. It was how it was calculated in 2022. We revised it to cap off the abatement that I can, um, provide or approve.

00:25:20,099	S13:
To 500.

00:25:20,869	S16:
To up to $500 if there's anything over 500. The resident has the ability to come before the select board or water commissioners, uh, for additional abatement. I just don't have the ability to approve.

00:25:34,500	S6:
Or to monetize the law. I mean, it's hard to monetize the loss of the town, but the town doesn't lose 5000 or $10,000, but they leave 10,000 billable.

00:25:42,769	S4:
You lost gallons, but then went back into the aquifer. Right. So it's.

00:25:46,329	S17:
Well, we.

00:25:48,069	S13:
The town is being asked to reimburse a private citizen for.

00:25:53,930	S14:
If we don't lose.

00:25:54,930	S6:
Revenue.

00:25:56,269	S14:
Right.

00:25:56,769	S6:
Because we wouldn't have had the revenue.

00:25:58,769	S14:
Right.

00:25:59,470	S16:
And like I said, the the preferred way is to have the the bill paid in full. Um, to be able to then work through this, um, without accruing any interest, as is, uh, taking some time. Um, the resident did pay the bill in full, uh, which is, uh, you know, he satisfied his part in that, um, to allow us to discuss this.

00:26:24,369	S2:
So, uh, and this happened last October. Is that one?

00:26:27,369	S16:
Yeah, it was in November, bill.

00:26:28,569	S2:
And so. And you looked at the prior three months to come up with your.

00:26:31,700	S4:
Prior three quarters.

00:26:32,670	S2:
Have you looked at it since then? Now to see if it's at that.

00:26:34,769	S15:
Time.

00:26:34,900	S16:
If everything goes back to normal.

00:26:36,470	S2:
The same levels. You came up with the dollar amount?

00:26:38,529	S16:
Uh, yeah. And we could tell the meter stopped spinning as well as soon as we made the repairs.

Yeah. 00:26:43,930	S6:
Joe. What? What? You know, I know we've we've we always have this discussion. We have a big bill, and we always sort of go around in circles. But I want I want to think about it in a different light because in terms of revenue, like we're not necessarily losing revenue because it's not like money we counted on.

00:26:56,529	S4:
Right.

00:26:56,799	S14:
So but.

00:26:57,329	S13:
It's also us reimbursing a citizen for unfortunate.

00:27:02,269	S14:
Issues.

Well. 00:27:03,970	S6:
Well, we're just not charging them for it.

00:27:05,769	S4:
Well, at this point you would be reimbursing because he's paid the bill.

00:27:08,700	S2:
I think the point is it's 100% reimbursement versus the whole abatement process is usually just a piece of a percentage of the total, right?

00:27:15,269	S4:
Well, this is only 50% of only 50%. So he was he he had a bill. He got a bill that was roughly $10,000. He he paid it all.

00:27:22,970	S2:
He was based on an average grant. Right. So he's paying for what.

00:27:26,400	S15:
He.

00:27:26,900	S16:
Usually calculates with the similar quarters. It usually does calculate to be about a 50% right around that. So of of of abatement amount. Okay.

Um. 00:27:38,569	S6:
Because it's a good system. He paid it up front.

00:27:40,670	S15:
But yeah.

00:27:42,630	S6:
I don't.

00:27:43,000	S2:
Know.

00:27:43,599	S6:
Any recommendations for.

00:27:45,670	S17:
I don't know.

00:27:46,599	S6:
Fair and reasonable.

00:27:48,430	S15:
Yeah.

00:27:48,700	S6:
So you could imagine.

00:27:49,470	S2:
There any reason why anybody else has went through the process in the past might say, hey, this was treated differently than me. I just want to understand.

00:27:56,369	S16:
They have every right to ever since. I mean, prior to 2022, before we changed the abatement, that was the way we calculated. And then it was up to the board, uh, the commissioners, to approve the abatement with that $500 cap. Um, we'd be able to handle some internally. Um, anything above it? Everybody has the right. Any any abatement, any citizen, any resident has the ability to appeal that. If you want to call it that, you can come before you, uh, with a, uh, with additional abatement request. And, uh, I did reach out to Mr. Durgin. I told him what my ability is, and he wanted to continue, uh, requesting additional abatement just because of the. I think because of the size of the bill and the size, you know, and and like I said, he did pay it. He paid in full.

00:28:46,000	S1:
Tim, to your knowledge, have.

00:28:47,269	S16:
We.

00:28:48,170	S1:
Had an abatement this high before in the past or like what is the highest year?

00:28:51,700	S16:
Yeah, we've had a we've had a high abatements like this in the past. Yeah. Even we've had it.

00:28:55,529	S6:
It's the most we've reimbursed.

00:28:56,769	S16:
I think the largest one that I remember was Asbury Grove.

00:29:00,069	S4:
Yeah. That was quite a bit higher than this.

00:29:02,029	S15:
Yeah.

00:29:02,400	S6:
What's the largest that we've discounted? The, uh.

00:29:05,000	S14:
The leak.

00:29:05,930	S16:
Asbury Grove was, uh. I think the bill was about 75 grand.

00:29:11,369	S4:
And you discounted.

00:29:12,329	S15:
Almost about half of that.

00:29:13,569	S4:
Yeah, almost 40,000 of it. You just kind of you took voted about $37,000 off of that bill.

00:29:19,730	S15:
Wow.

00:29:20,269	S2:
Through this same process.

00:29:21,670	S15:
It's.

00:29:21,829	S4:
The same process. But that was that was prior to 2022.

00:29:24,829	S15:
That was.

00:29:25,170	S4:
That was still would have come.

00:29:25,930	S15:
To you. Right? Yeah.

00:29:26,569	S6:
Right. Not money out of our pocket.

00:29:27,869	S14:
It's just.

00:29:28,829	S6:
Right. It's just lost water. So the penalty for lost water is. I mean, it goes through our system. We're treating it.

00:29:35,970	S15:
So it's.

00:29:36,930	S16:
Been recorded. I mean, we record that through the through his meter. It's not lost and not recorded. Right. We've recorded it. Obviously we've built.

00:29:45,930	S15:
It.

00:29:46,369	S16:
And I think this is just as an abatement based on an unfortunate leak, um, that's been repaired. It hasn't gone unrepaired. Uh, sometimes we do run it.

00:29:57,769	S2:
He did everything right.

00:29:58,630	S16:
He definitely. He did everything right. Um, and, uh, that's why I approved the up to the 500. Because I felt that it was. That was a, uh, abatement that I should approve. Um, I just, like I said, I don't have the ability to do anything more than that.

00:30:13,470	S2:
Is it fair to ask if you have an opinion?

00:30:16,230	S16:
I if you like my opinion. Um. I feel that everything was followed correctly.

00:30:22,900	S15:
It seems.

00:30:23,200	S1:
Like he.

00:30:23,430	S15:
Did.

00:30:24,099	S1:
No fault of his own. He repaired it right away. He paid the bill in full immediately.

00:30:30,099	S15:
But the court, in fact, the town.

00:30:31,630	S6:
Was the town we lose by having the 10,000 gallons go through our system. And or $10,000 through a system and down into.

00:30:38,269	S15:
The.

00:30:38,670	S16:
I mean, it's it's minimal for a quarter of revenue. It's after I mean, we're pushing usually.

00:30:49,769	S15:
What's what's.

00:30:50,369	S4:
Your average quarterly billing.

00:30:51,430	S16:
It's like 500 and some a thousand we get in revenue. So a quarter about 1%.

00:30:56,799	S4:
So.

00:31:03,069	S4:
That about one tenth of 1%. Sorry. One tenth of 1%.

00:31:07,230	S16:
Yeah. And it's a one time as a baby, right? It's a one time in ten years. Um, you know, so it's it's an unfortunate.

00:31:16,730	S4:
Well, you know, to that, you know, we have had people who have had, you know, toilets that weren't fixed, that we apprised them of it and they didn't fix the toilet. And this board has denied other abatements for not being willing to actually address the problem we had.

00:31:33,869	S2:
That's the type of thing we would see on a normal basis.

00:31:36,369	S4:
We had we had somebody come in after three quarters of high buildings wanting to be abated, and Tim had been able to prove that they had notified him in the first quarter, after the first quarter, high usage and gave him the, you know, gave them ideas to look for. And they didn't do any of those things. And the Select board voted subsequently to not give an abatement because they hadn't followed. You know, they hadn't tried to address the situation until almost a year later.

00:31:59,099	S16:
We don't really have the technology to track that leak live. Um, it's unfortunately it happens. We could. It could be the day after we read in. Three months later, we're reading it again, and we've got three months of of leak. Um, there are meters. It is a larger, uh, discussion we can have, but there are meters that we can upgrade those in the system. It's it's costly. But to have that live read is possible. It's just would take, uh, some infrastructure improvements and, and a meter, uh, program and things like.

00:32:34,230	S2:
People could buy flow meters to and find out on their own, right, if they were losing water. Or am I making that up?

00:32:40,170	S16:
Uh, they could. Yeah. I mean, it depends on where the meter lies and where the leak is. Um, you know, sometimes it's before the meter and we would never see it, and neither would the billing. Um, It would be a pressure issue if anything.

So. 00:32:57,069	S13:
So I'm not unsympathetic to the issue, but I also.

00:33:03,700	S17:
I.

00:33:04,769	S13:
Just.

00:33:05,170	S17:
Have.

00:33:05,799	S13:
Very mixed feelings about this. How long exactly was the leak for? Was it. Did it continue for it?

00:33:13,799	S16:
It we when we found it, it was the day after it was fixed.

Okay. 00:33:18,670	S13:
Um, but but my question is how how long did.

00:33:23,069	S6:
This in a build? Less than a billion.

00:33:24,369	S2:
So it was within the three months.

00:33:25,630	S6:
To build it?

00:33:26,569	S16:
Yeah.

00:33:27,000	S2:
Yeah. So once they got the bill, they hooped some.

00:33:29,000	S6:
First bill was good. The next bill was bad. So then they said, oh shoot, what's going on?

00:33:32,569	S13:
And what did you say the average water bill was. Did you. Did you have any.

00:33:37,400	S18:
For this particular.

00:33:38,869	S13:
For this residence?

00:33:40,029	S16:
It should be. I, I, I can't remember what it's on there. Um, the first page.

00:33:43,970	S4:
Typically about $170, 170 to $300 between one, you know, less than a span of $130 difference from quarter to quarter. And that would that would always change depending on the time of year.

00:33:57,900	S2:
But I think from a gallon gallon consumption, is that where you're going? Is this the right time? 35,039 and then it went to 500,000 488,000. Right. So we're talking hundreds of thousands of gallons.

00:34:12,199	S16:
Um, yeah. There was obviously something happened, uh, compared to it in the past. And that's.

00:34:17,329	S6:
The other.

00:34:17,570	S4:
Thing to keep.

00:34:17,929	S6:
In.

00:34:18,000	S16:
Mind. You get it flagged. Gail, um, she's very good in the accounting and the budget or the water billing. She saw that not being a normal read at that address, so she flagged it. She told our guys to go out there and investigate it that day.

00:34:34,900	S13:
Oh. She did?

00:34:35,570	S16:
Yeah.

00:34:36,130	S4:
The other thing to keep in mind is that we have a tiered billing system. So the more more water was lost, the more they'd be charged for the lost water, which, you know, in this situation is where if somebody is being charged because they feel their swimming pool, that's one thing. If somebody's being charged because there was a water leak they didn't know about it.

00:34:57,829	S17:
What do you think?

00:34:59,630	S6:
I think we should increase the abatement. I just don't know what the what the right value is. I don't know if it's 2000. If it's 5000, it's somewhere between 5000 and 500. So I'm going to. So I would say.

00:35:09,730	S4:
That your previous policy before you gave Tim the ability to do up to 500 was to follow the formula that Tim used. And until you change the formula, I would suggest you you would want to follow the same. If you're going to give Grant another abatement, you'd follow the same formula.

00:35:23,769	S1:
Yeah. Until we change.

00:35:24,599	S4:
Until you change that.

00:35:25,469	S1:
Formula.

00:35:26,429	S4:
Otherwise you're just picking a number.

00:35:27,599	S13:
And we're.

00:35:28,429	S17:
Supposed.

00:35:28,730	S4:
To agree.

00:35:29,199	S13:
To one abatement per.

00:35:31,170	S4:
One abatement per household.

Yeah. 00:35:32,769	S17:
Okay.

00:35:33,329	S13:
And we did.

00:35:33,829	S17:
That.

Okay. 00:35:35,199	S4:
Well, this would be part of the same abatement because abatement.

00:35:38,230	S17:
Yeah.

00:35:38,530	S13:
Right. That's that's what I'm saying.

00:35:40,269	S2:
He hit his max, and then the next time he.

00:35:41,869	S6:
Gets to come to it, that's how it works. He can go up to 500. Then he comes out some more. That's what he did. The right process. Yeah. Sorry. What is that number then? You said it was the googly. What's the maximum calculated.

00:35:53,429	S4:
In the.

00:35:54,469	S6:
Current policy?

00:35:55,300	S4:
So. So the total revised bill would be down to $5,010.

00:35:59,300	S6:
So it'll be a 5000.

00:36:00,500	S4:
It would be about a $5,000 decrease.

Yeah. 00:36:03,369	S6:
Right. So you're saying don't pick between five do either the either the way our policy is written or do it where we're at 500. Is that your recommendation?

00:36:10,500	S4:
Yeah. I mean and obviously the total revision would be to the higher number. And, you know, minus the 500 has already been granted. So and that wouldn't necessarily have to be granted in terms of a payment would just would put a credit on the account. And until that credit was reached, you just wouldn't have a bill. That's a that's one way to handle it. Yeah. So you're not paying money out of the out of the town or having to write a check. You just make a credit to the account.

00:36:35,699	S1:
Is that our decision or is that the.

00:36:37,269	S4:
That's your decision as well. You're the water commissioner.

00:36:38,900	S2:
So we can do it in form of credits versus cash, basically.

00:36:41,199	S1:
Yeah. I'm just curious if that.

00:36:42,400	S17:
Was.

00:36:42,699	S13:
It's either the 5000 or.

00:36:44,570	S17:
Nothing.

00:36:44,900	S4:
Until you have a until you go through a process of policy of of changing the policy. I would recommend that because otherwise it could be arbitrary and capricious, and somebody would, could come back and say, you didn't have any grounds to make that decision. What did you base that on?

00:36:58,570	S1:
What are we basing that off of?

00:36:59,869	S19:
May I add one thing to what, Tim? Absolutely, sir. Thank you. Mark Durgin, I am the resident of 293.

00:37:05,570	S2:
I'm sorry this happened to you.

00:37:07,000	S19:
Pardon me.

00:37:07,699	S2:
I'm sorry this happened to you.

00:37:09,530	S19:
Me too. Um, when Mr. Isbell came out to notify me about the leak, I asked him how much water were we talking about? He said he came out on the. He read the meter on the 21st and it was 500,000 gallons. And he said, I read it again this morning and it was another 1800 thousand or 18,000 gallons. So this wasn't negligent, this wasn't leaky toilets. And there was zero evidence on our property that there was a major leak. And Mr. Isbell did walk the property with me, and he was joined by Mr. Dolan, I believe, who is his supervisor afterwards. And there was absolutely no the only way we could tell that there was a leak was by reading the meter.

00:37:54,269	S4:
So you're averaging 18,000 lost per day. So 500,000 divided by 18, 18,000 would be how many days it was. So it wasn't even a full quarter of loss.

00:38:04,269	S17:
Yeah. What was.

00:38:05,269	S13:
The problem? Pardon me. What was the ultimate problem?

00:38:08,769	S19:
Well, we haven't excavated it. We have? Shut it off. We're not sure yet if we're going to rerun that line out. It's going to be expensive to do that, I'm sure. So we're still trying to sort that out. And no, we wouldn't do anything until the spring if we do anything at all. So we might just cap off the line.

Period. 00:38:29,099	S2:
Gotcha.

00:38:32,369	S6:
Um, I'll make a motion to, uh, to, uh, extend the rebate equal our Are max allowable under our policy.

00:38:43,800	S2:
And then that's due this 5010.70. Is that what we're looking at here or is it. There's that to this nine -500.

00:38:51,300	S4:
-500.

00:38:52,000	S6:
Yeah.

Total. 00:38:52,769	S4:
The total the total max to the maximum allowable.

00:38:55,699	S16:
There's a there should be a new bill I almost like created a new build.

00:38:59,769	S4:
Yep.

00:39:00,199	S16:
And then the difference from the original bill to the new bill is the abatement.

00:39:04,000	S2:
Okay. Got it.

00:39:06,000	S19:
So the bill that I just received was under $400.

Right? 00:39:10,900	S16:
Right, right. So we know that in fact that's a normal read.

00:39:17,300	S2:
Right. So forms of a credit might be a lifelong and.

00:39:21,599	S4:
It might take a while. My might you might want to let him cut a check. In this case you might want to cut a check. I'm guessing credit might be about ten years. It might be about ten years.

00:39:31,099	S6:
I didn't figure out the way to make it right, but at least we can give the.

00:39:34,199	S2:
Unless the credits are transferable. And then we could all like by.

00:39:37,070	S4:
Oh, I think that's all right.

00:39:40,369	S2:
So we have a motion on the floor.

00:39:41,570	S6:
The motion is a motion. Good. Is that enough of a motion, Joe? Or do I.

00:39:44,500	S2:
Need to say the amount? But yeah.

00:39:46,500	S4:
You're basically saying to okay.

00:39:48,730	S6:
Yeah, yeah.

00:39:49,570	S2:
Okay. I'm good with that. We have a second.

00:39:53,099	S1:
Yeah I second.

00:39:55,400	S2:
All in favor?

00:39:57,699	S16:
Yeah. I just. Could I just say, is this a in the form of a refund check or a credit.

00:40:04,269	S4:
Given in the amount of it? They just said that it'd be fine to do a refund check, because it might take them ten years to get the. You might go ten years without a vote.

00:40:11,599	S2:
So yeah, that's the right question. We did talk about it a little bit and said that would.

00:40:14,699	S16:
You just want to make sure I knew how to tell Gael on how to apply the.

00:40:19,170	S4:
Um, do a refund.

00:40:19,969	S16:
Check to the account?

00:40:21,300	S2:
And I think we should maybe. I mean, if you do go back and replace the line, I don't know that we're coming back again with something else on that line, but I think that would, uh. Yeah, I like that you capped it, but I think we got to be careful about that.

00:40:33,369	S16:
Yeah, I've talked to Mr. Jurgen about if there's any, um, construction planned to have us. Make sure that we're aware of it. Perfect. Perfect. Yep. We'll have to get a permit anyway. That's correct.

00:40:47,869	S2:
All right. Appreciate it.

00:40:49,199	S6:
Thank you.

00:40:49,469	S4:
Tim, can you hang in for a minute? The next one, I think I just want your input on. Just in case.

00:40:55,400	S4:
Thanks, Mr.

Durkin. 00:40:57,800	S2:
All right. Second. Next on the agenda is a request from the friends of the Council of Aging.

00:41:04,530	S13:
So actually, not the council.

00:41:06,369	S4:
The friends of the friends of the Council on Aging. It's the friends group.

00:41:09,030	S13:
The friends of the Arts.

00:41:11,469	S2:
There. We got it. Do I have it in here?

00:41:12,769	S4:
I'm sorry. I'm contacting you on behalf of the friends of the Council on Aging.

No. 00:41:16,170	S6:
Friends of the Council of.

00:41:17,269	S4:
Friends and the Council on Aging. Friends. Hamilton CEO. It's A501 C3 that's been raising money to help, uh, run programming at the. And they're simply asking letters in your packet. They're asking to be able to put out a request for you can't.

00:41:31,769	S20:
I can't get my packet up.

00:41:33,429	S4:
Really?

00:41:34,800	S13:
The the email didn't come through.

00:41:36,929	S20:
I got it up.

00:41:38,130	S13:
Oh, you missed.

00:41:38,769	S20:
A perfect no.

00:41:39,369	S2:
Did you? Did you look under it?

00:41:42,000	S6:
It didn't open up on my phone, but I can't.

00:41:43,869	S13:
I can't say okay, good. I'm. Thank God you're here, bill.

00:41:46,929	S4:
Michelle Borgen from the friend who's the chair of the friends of the council. Friends of the council who's online. She's willing to speak to this if you have questions, but basically, they're asking to be able to.

00:41:56,929	S20:
Read on my phone.

00:41:57,929	S4:
Yeah, basically, they're asking if we could if they could put a request for donations to the friends of the Council on Aging into the water bills, the way the Hamilton Foundation does.

00:42:08,030	S2:
That, water bills.

00:42:09,429	S1:
Well.

00:42:11,130	S4:
This is something that this is something that the town of the Selectboard is allowed in the past. As I said, it's an annual fundraising drive for the friends for the Hamilton Foundation that way. Would you like to speak to Miss Horgan?

00:42:25,670	S13:
Yes. Of course.

00:42:26,730	S4:
Michelle, welcome.

00:42:28,699	S21:
Hi. Thank you so much. I appreciate you taking the time to look at this. A little background. The friends of the Hamilton CoA was established over three years ago at the urging of the current director, Teresa. Since that time, we have raised funds through the newsletter and various fundraising events to help our seniors in town with events such as a holiday luncheon. We hosted a trip to the casino. We are planning a luncheon in March, so the request in front of you this evening is to allow the friends of the Hamilton CoA um, an insertion in the water bill, similar to what you allow the Hamilton Foundation to do in the December water bill, just to ask people to consider donating to our fund in an effort to help the seniors in town.

00:43:28,130	S21:
Does anyone have any questions?

00:43:31,070	S2:
Uh, no. Thank you. Have we done? And maybe. Sorry if I missed it. Other solicitations for funding.

00:43:37,429	S13:
Hamilton.

00:43:38,329	S4:
I think the Hamilton Foundation is the only solicitation for funding, but we definitely added things into the water bill in the past. Okay. Uh, other than solicitation, so.

00:43:47,130	S2:
Do we have other opportunities for them to reach out? I like the cause and that. So, um, so.

00:43:52,170	S4:
I mean, they're not a town entity, so they'd have to look for your permission to do anything else, um, using town resources. But they have their own resources. They can they can do without our input, or they can come to the board, as they're doing now and ask us to use time, resources.

00:44:08,769	S13:
Everything they do directly benefits the Council on Aging. So, you know, I'm going to make that motion.

00:44:14,400	S4:
It's it not only directly benefits, but it's done. I believe in coordination with the actual Council on Aging and the senior Center director.

00:44:21,170	S6:
So always 100% for these things. I always think the worst case scenarios or anything. Is there any precedent setting that you're going to be fighting in the future.

00:44:27,369	S2:
Like one other 501 C3 could come at that. We might not want to. Or would it?

00:44:32,829	S4:
Well, you've already opened the door because the Hamilton Foundation. So you're really going to be.

00:44:37,869	S13:
If.

00:44:38,829	S4:
It's at your discretion. You have the ability.

00:44:40,670	S2:
You like precedent?

00:44:41,500	S4:
Yeah.

00:44:44,469	S16:
Yeah.

00:44:47,300	S2:
That's true.

00:44:49,329	S13:
It's not a 501 CE, but it's not officially. It is?

00:44:55,130	S21:
No, we are, we are. We are an official. 501 C3.

00:45:00,300	S4:
Yeah. No, we're we're saying the Hamilton Foundation. Michelle, the Hamilton Foundation is not A51 C3.

00:45:06,230	S13:
Just tried to clarify their position.

00:45:11,500	S2:
Mr. attorney, any thoughts on precedents?

00:45:15,070	S13:
Um, well, if it's at our discretion.

00:45:20,230	S1:
It's the question.

00:45:22,070	S6:
I think precedent. They're not a town organization, but the money 100% benefits of town. So if somebody else comes and says, I says, I want to put something in your water, bill. And we say, no.

00:45:31,570	S22:
Can I share? Um, just.

00:45:34,800	S8:
I feel like we had this conversation about the picnic, and, like, there was all sorts of different conversations around whether we should or shouldn't have included different. I just feel like that conversation needs to be taken into consideration. And do I remember the details?

00:45:53,329	S13:
I don't think about the, uh, digital board in front of.

00:45:59,269	S8:
Right. There was. And then there was like, there was things on the website and sponsoring. And so I was just trying I just wanted to because I can't remember details, but I thought it at least needed to be in the mix of the conversation.

00:46:11,469	S13:
That was a little different.

00:46:12,969	S6:
That the town don't need an organization.

00:46:14,599	S13:
Right. I think I think we actually we could use that analogy of using the digital board in front of the public safety building that we decided as a board that if a friends of directly benefits a town entity that we were going to allow them to advertise.

00:46:33,400	S4:
So we just have to bring that request to you.

00:46:35,199	S7:
Correct.

00:46:35,969	S13:
Correct. So, so I think based on that decision, there's there's there's our precedent that I think that that would fall in line because the CEO, the friends of the CEO directly benefit that co town entity.

00:46:52,599	S2:
So why don't we get a motion if there's any further discussion after that?

00:46:55,769	S13:
So I'll make a motion that we approve the friends of the CoA, um, including a flyer in the member. What is what is in the next water bill?

00:47:08,670	S6:
The court.

00:47:09,030	S4:
Next court. Next quarter.

Oroville. 00:47:10,429	S13:
The next single quarterly water.

00:47:12,429	S6:
Bill at one time.

00:47:13,429	S13:
Yep.

00:47:15,630	S2:
Any further discussion on that?

00:47:17,170	S6:
I'll second that.

00:47:18,269	S2:
We'll get a second.

00:47:19,769	S6:
So I'm in favor unless somebody can tell me the worst case scenario. So I'm always a worst case scenario person, but I don't have an issue with this specifically. But it's what happens after this.

00:47:30,900	S13:
Yeah, I think if it's something that directly benefits an entity in the town like that, friends.

00:47:36,829	S2:
It's in line with our.

00:47:38,300	S13:
Yeah. And so I don't have any issues with it.

00:47:44,500	S9:
Are you going to vote?

00:47:45,130	S2:
All right. All in favor?

00:47:47,369	S6:
So I guess I would say that just for the record, that we're that we're going to be in favor because of 100% of the proceeds benefit a town organization. Correct? Correct. And there's no profit and there's no other. There's not no event we're monitoring. It's just a fundraiser. And the fundraising goes directly.

00:47:59,929	S13:
Entirely and entirely right. Michele. It goes entirely toward events and programs at the Council on Aging.

Correct? 00:48:08,670	S21:
That is correct. We are a complete volunteer board. And every every.

00:48:12,730	S2:
Dollar.

00:48:14,030	S1:
So this is different from the picnic?

00:48:16,530	S6:
Yeah, because we the town was donating money to the picnic.

00:48:19,769	S4:
Oh, no, that's not true. We we were excited. We were sighted. We were. We were cited as a sponsor, but we didn't actually give any money. And we didn't ask to be recognized as a sponsor. That's not.

00:48:28,730	S6:
But so it's totally different.

00:48:29,769	S1:
But they were the town and that was just highlighting the advertising. Right. The picnic. Right. As a sponsor, they.

00:48:35,869	S2:
Were supporting and we didn't have any control of what was being done at that picnic here at the Council of Agent. We do. And we have.

00:48:41,570	S4:
A because the friends, the friends at the council.

00:48:43,599	S2:
Know exactly what's going to happen within those walls. Things that happened at the picnic that we weren't aware of. Caught us by surprise. And we didn't think maybe that was appropriate, you know, for town funding, which was the sponsorship and such right now.

00:48:56,570	S4:
But again, there wasn't a sponsorship anyway. But yes, I know.

00:48:59,530	S2:
There.

00:48:59,670	S4:
Wasn't.

00:49:00,070	S6:
But the town.

00:49:01,500	S2:
Even even the name.

00:49:02,869	S4:
Was not to give them any money.

00:49:03,900	S2:
But.

00:49:04,530	S6:
It was on the right.

00:49:06,130	S4:
Yeah. Yeah. Some, some. Somebody applied the town seal. They didn't ask us to. They just did.

00:49:11,000	S2:
But the sponsorship doesn't have to be financial. I mean, it, um, so I think that's how I look at the difference.

00:49:17,900	S1:
Yeah. I mean, I just, I support this. I mean, I support the CoA. It just feels like we're picking and choosing, you know, sort of the initiatives that, you know.

00:49:25,670	S4:
Well, well, that.

00:49:26,630	S2:
I.

00:49:27,099	S4:
That is essentially what the Select board is allowed to do. But and as long as you can state, you know succinctly what you know, your justification is, I believe you've just done, um, that you're allowed to do that, as does the town's executive body.

00:49:41,969	S1:
Okay.

00:49:42,829	S2:
I just I can separate these two. It's just like then I think about, well, how often should we solicit money? We're already asking for your tax dollars. Now we're asking for this. Yes. It's voluntarily, but is there a too much? You know, asking for money no matter what it's for, you know, because all of a sudden it could be a vehicle for everything.

00:49:59,800	S1:
A fair question, but.

00:50:03,369	S1:
So up to Human Rights Commission came back and.

00:50:06,769	S4:
Right.

00:50:08,170	S2:
So. Right. It's limited. But what other what other 501 C3 or anything else might come and use those. So might we have ten inserts in a water bill at some point. You know I'm being extreme Intentionally.

00:50:19,000	S6:
That's what I was doing. Worst case. Right. This water bill? Yeah.

00:50:22,730	S13:
Uh oh.

00:50:23,670	S6:
Well.

00:50:25,030	S4:
I'd suggest if you allowed that many that nobody would get anything.

00:50:28,500	S6:
Because.

00:50:29,000	S2:
I don't see that ever happening either. I think people. I think this is a controlled. You know. So. Okay. So all in favor?

00:50:36,699	S6:
Aye.

00:50:37,929	S2:
Those opposed? Okay. It passes 3 to 1.

00:50:43,130	S21:
Great. Um, just thank you very much. On behalf of the friends of the Hamilton CoA. Just as a side note to, we would never want to take away any funds from the Hamilton Foundation because that is an extremely important entity in town. So absolutely, we would in conjunction and appreciate all that you've done for us. So thank you.

00:50:59,530	S13:
Thank you Michel.

00:51:01,630	S21:
Good night.

00:51:02,769	S2:
But I like letting citizens decide where they want to put their money to. And this does allow even if they got three inserts, you know, like I want to help this or that.

00:51:09,829	S9:
So that's true.

00:51:14,130	S9:
Okay.

00:51:15,530	S13:
Here we go.

00:51:16,969	S2:
Yeah, right. Friends of Rosemary.

00:51:21,469	S2:
All right.

00:51:22,329	S6:
Go pump me the.

00:51:24,630	S4:
Next, uh. The next item on the agenda was request. Uh. Thanks, Tim, I appreciate it. I didn't know if you'd want to chime in on that, so that's.

00:51:31,199	S2:
Thanks, Tim.

00:51:32,099	S4:
Um, the, uh, the next letter is a request from Verizon, uh, for the town to author a letter of support to the Massachusetts Broadband Institute for a program that would expand, uh, fiber optics in the community, and specifically a fiber optics into the underserved and unserved, uh, members of our community. It's just a letter. Uh, they offered us draft, uh, language that we could use if put on our letterhead. And you could either have it. If you choose to go in this direction, you could either have it for me to sign on behalf of the board or for the chair to sign, or we can bring it back in next meeting. You can all sign it up to you. But that was a request to the of Verizon and it doesn't cost us anything, but it does allow Verizon to use some state entities to get grant funds that would help expand

00:52:23,070	S4:
broadband and WiFi in the town to people who don't currently have it.

00:52:28,099	S13:
It's for like the downtown area is this.

00:52:32,300	S2:
Area where they don't have service today? Yeah. Yeah. Look at their map of where they laid fiber.

00:52:36,400	S9:
Okay.

00:52:36,829	S2:
Because there are some other we did they give any thing about our municipalities specifically that is unserved or underserved?

00:52:43,900	S4:
We actually for as far as fiber goes, we have a pretty robust fiber network. We we ourselves have a good fiber network. We've been looked at regionally as somebody to help link other communities. So we had fiber laid in in Hamilton and connecting to Wenham for, I think, close to a decade now. But other communities have looked to link to ours to get to other places. So A6 is tacked on so they could connect to Danvers, for instance. So, uh, municipally, we're well positioned. It's just that that fiber optic network doesn't serve all of our residents.

So. 00:53:19,099	S4:
Just for your you to consider.

00:53:20,730	S9:
Yes.

00:53:21,230	S13:
So do you understand this?

00:53:24,699	S9:
I do, okay I do.

00:53:25,869	S13:
Can you explain a little bit? Is is it one of those. And please excuse my my ignorance on in this matter. I'm not a real techie person. So is this saying that you would put that they would put little.

00:53:43,230	S9:
Mini.

00:53:44,500	S13:
Cells?

00:53:45,699	S2:
Well, no, I mean, they would have to come back to us for any attachments to utilize. This is laying fiber like throughout and getting to where we where they don't have servers, they're underserved. And there's economic challenges. This shows whoever they go to for money that there are underserved communities. And we have municipalities that support this effort to to serve them broadband. Right. So but.

00:54:09,170	S9:
It's.

00:54:09,469	S13:
It's about locations, doesn't.

00:54:11,269	S9:
It?

00:54:11,429	S2:
It does, but we might be a connector for somebody else that might come in to us. You know, like.

00:54:15,969	S13:
So it's where it's not the fiber optics is not laid. They want to put cables in. Is that.

00:54:22,829	S9:
It?

00:54:23,130	S6:
Yeah.

00:54:23,599	S4:
It's mostly on telephone poles these days. They don't dig. Right. It's a lot of a lot of a lot of fiber optics.

00:54:28,469	S2:
Most of it is above. But they'll trench. They'll definitely trench.

00:54:31,199	S13:
Okay.

So. 00:54:32,000	S2:
But that we're not saying you coming to Trench in Hamilton. We're just saying that, you know, we support the growth of.

00:54:38,369	S9:
Fiber.

00:54:38,869	S13:
And we.

00:54:39,400	S9:
Do.

00:54:40,030	S2:
And but they're going through Beverly right now. Believe it or not, Beverly does not have Fios everywhere. And they've put in new teams and they're going in. You're going to see, you know, some work done on streets in Beverly.

00:54:51,969	S9:
Okay.

00:54:52,530	S4:
So provides it provides discounted home internet service for equipment rental fees, annual contracts and data caps for for qualifying income eligible households.

00:55:01,730	S2:
Right. So there was an infrastructure bill, right. That part of that was serving underutilized communities, small town rural America and getting access to the internet for students kids. You know, a lot of the carriers are doing this. T-Mobile, for instance, has got a 10 million program where they're trying to get, you know, families that can't afford internet, internet. So kids can do homework and stuff and learn via the internet. So this is really the backbone and the infrastructure. The Verizon's and other fiber companies lay out the the network that will ride on top of that.

00:55:33,429	S13:
It's going to be do you know if it's going to be very intrusive?

00:55:37,969	S2:
See, this to me is in any agreement to say go ahead and do anything in Hamilton. It's just saying we support the growth. So I don't know.

00:55:44,630	S4:
They, they, they essentially they Verizon essentially wants to go to the Massachusetts Broadband Institute and ask for availability of funds to be able to do some of this work. Once they get the funds, they still have to come to you to get permission to tranche or put to do that stuff. But that's why they don't have the funds right now.

00:55:57,369	S2:
So that's why I asked if we're a part of that area that underserved. I don't think we are. So I don't think we'll ever see it. But it's just but we're saying, hey, we support Joe mentioned some other surrounding communities perhaps have to. Might tie into us.

00:56:10,269	S4:
And there might be pockets of neighborhoods in this community. Where there's folks that are underserved.

00:56:14,630	S6:
Or they.

00:56:14,900	S2:
Could increase capacity. They could do a. Lot of things, potentially.

00:56:17,570	S13:
They need to increase capacity.

00:56:19,030	S2:
So you could see.

00:56:19,570	S9:
Work done in our heads all the time.

00:56:21,900	S2:
Yeah. I don't look at this as them saying, hey, we're going to go dig things out.

00:56:25,829	S13:
Okay. I'm sorry I didn't understand that. And thank you for explaining it.

00:56:30,829	S2:
So this was due on the 19th, it said.

00:56:36,329	S4:
Yes, I missed that.

00:56:37,170	S2:
I know we passed.

00:56:38,630	S4:
I think that we could probably still submit them a letter if we're late.

00:56:42,929	S6:
No, not still not better late than never.

00:56:45,170	S9:
I'm not the only one.

00:56:46,000	S13:
Who's having.

00:56:46,500	S9:
That issue.

00:56:47,269	S4:
They didn't.

00:56:47,730	S6:
Get me.

00:56:48,230	S4:
This.

00:56:48,469	S16:
Request.

00:56:49,300	S2:
I mean, I'm sure.

00:56:50,269	S4:
They didn't get me this request in a way that I could get it to you before now. Okay. Because the email came to me after the third and you didn't have another meeting prior today, so.

Okay. 00:56:59,269	S2:
No worries.

Um. 00:57:00,900	S13:
All right.

00:57:01,570	S2:
Let's go through the process anyway. I'm sure if we can help if we choose to. But can I get a motion to approve a letter be submitted by Jo on our letterhead to support Verizon's, uh.

00:57:19,929	S2:
What growth in their network to underserved.

00:57:21,869	S4:
To support their application to the Massachusetts Broadband Institute.

00:57:24,969	S6:
So moved.

00:57:25,869	S13:
Second.

00:57:27,400	S2:
Any further discussion? All in favor?

00:57:30,570	S6:
All right.

00:57:30,929	S1:
All right.

00:57:31,530	S4:
Okay. Thank you.

00:57:32,530	S13:
And thank you for explaining that.

00:57:35,800	S9:
Great.

00:57:36,469	S4:
There's a. The next item is a group of email conversations between ourselves and gentlemen that's helping to run the Maine Barrel program in Wenham. There's been some requests for us to rejoin that. We had done that for years and had dropped off, I think prior to right around Covid, and Jeremy Foster had been working to help us understand what it would take for us to do this. I'm looking for the select boards. If you want to support this authorization to set aside some of money to be able to help, drive down the cost a little bit. Jeremy Foster is here. He can probably answer questions for you if you like.

00:58:18,900	S4:
Jeremy.

00:58:20,030	S23:
Yes, I'm here online. Good evening. Thank you. So, considering this.

00:58:26,599	S6:
Is it is is it seed money to buy the barrels and sell them, or is it to actually supplement the cost?

00:58:31,769	S23:
It would be to supplement the cost the way it worked previously. It's a partnership between towns in the Ipswich River watershed area and the Great American Rain Barrel Company. So they sell rain barrels through through their own outlet. But what's what we used to do in Hamilton and many other communities in this area do, is they allocate some funds towards the program so that residents can then get a discounted rain barrel. And I know that Hamilton was doing this at least through 2018. And so the way it would work would be if Hamilton were to allocate a budget, and the town could then decide what the discount would be per person and cap the number of people. So, for example, a $2,000 um, allocation could allow 50 residents to have a $40 discount, or 40 residents have a $50 discount. So it can work in many different ways. Um, and it would really just support the water resiliency programs that are in place. Now, you've probably heard about the North Shore Water Resilience Task Force, which is led by Senator Brad Tarr and includes 24 state representatives, including our own Kristin Kastner. Um, so this this scheme is really trying to protect the water supply in this area and raise awareness. Um, and it would also show Hamilton in a positive light. Many of the communities have already signed up for this when and does it every year. I think North Redding, Redding, Danvers, Salem, North Andover, they're all engaged with it as well.

00:00:00,430	S1:
Can we support the program without actually funding it?

00:00:04,129	S2:
How much is a barrel if somebody if we weren't in the program.

00:00:07,570	S3:
So a barrel if you were just to buy it from one of the outlets that sell them retails, I think it's $129. And for example, I think when I bought one through the Hamilton program a few years ago, and I think I got a 40 or $50 discount, and I think that's what Wenham also do. They keep at it. I think it's either the first 50 or 60 respondents and they offer a $40 discount. So it's in that sort of 2000, $2,500 range is the Wenham program. That's not to say that Hamilton don't do whatever they might prefer.

00:00:39,000	S2:
So from a logistics perspective, would we be going out and buying a bunch of barrels up front?

00:00:43,869	S3:
No, actually, I've been talking to Eric Mansfield, who's the water superintendent for the town of Wenham. And in previous years, in fact, when I got mine several years ago, I ordered through Hamilton but went and collected it from the Grapevine Road DPW. So Eric has said once again that Hamilton. Hamilton could just piggyback off the Wenham ordering system, and then he would also take care of the distribution to any. Hamilton residents who signed up. So. Sort of bandwidth for Hamilton would be minimal. It would really just be the budget component.

00:01:14,930	S1:
I mean, I'm not in favor of funding the lottery.

00:01:17,629	S4:
In the first place.

00:01:18,370	S1:
Look at it. I mean, I'm in favor of the program, but I don't think we should.

00:01:21,230	S5:
Well, so if the town had done that before. Yeah. Can you totally agree with that before?

00:01:24,900	S2:
And why we stopped? So stopped for a reason.

00:01:26,870	S5:
I, I think that what.

00:01:28,829	S1:
Happened is due to Sean's Farrell's heart.

00:01:30,469	S5:
Sean Farrell, I believe, started the program, got the program off the ground. I remember, I remember in 2019, um, during the period when people could sign up. Not many people had signed up.

00:01:41,129	S6:
Right. I think that was.

00:01:42,129	S5:
And then in 2020, it was Covid. And so we just we stepped away from the program and we haven't come back to it. I think in 2021, Wenham allowed some Hamilton residents to sign up, but they just couldn't get the discount. And, uh, maybe only a handful of people had taken advantage of the program without the discount. So the idea is you can say that you're supporting it. But if you if you give a little bit of money to it, you're really supporting it and not saying that you should or shouldn't. That's your decision. But, um, for a small amount of money, $2,000, you could take a discount on the first 40 residents you've been averaging in the past, somewhere between 41 and 60. It was a high of 60 in the first year and a low of 40 in the fourth year. So, um.

00:02:20,400	S6:
And where do we get them?

00:02:22,069	S5:
I did a couple options. I would recommend that if you want to go in this direction, you ask me to find the funds. There's usually some money in my budget. At the end of the year, I could take it out of supplies, or we could seek a we could seek, um, a transfer from the reserve fund. If income. Either of those would.

00:02:39,599	S1:
Be mind less people by the barrels.

00:02:41,430	S2:
Yeah. So you don't pay 2000 up front. It's. No. Yeah. I think I like the example numbers. And you're good with leveraging Venom's distribution process and makes sense.

00:02:50,270	S6:
I like the larger discount. It is like the lottery.

00:02:54,370	S1:
Yeah. I'm in favour of everything except funding. Like a lottery. It was like 40 people signed up and then the 41st person doesn't get the deal.

00:03:00,770	S6:
But yeah, but 40 is kind of.

00:03:03,469	S2:
40 is good. I mean, if it's 129, right.

00:03:06,870	S6:
I think that's pretty good, right? So and if you think in 2018 there were 40 barrels. So that's good.

00:03:12,800	S2:
I mean it's a balance of making it worth it and hitting more people in a in a cap number.

00:03:18,569	S6:
Yeah. People should listen to this.

00:03:20,300	S4:
I mean this is Sean Farrell. Barrow Farrell Farrell.

00:03:27,169	S5:
Sean Sean might like that.

00:03:28,699	S2:
And we could we could at some point add money to it if, if it was very successful.

00:03:33,199	S5:
So if you want us to go in this direction, I'd recommend that you put a cap, a dollar amount and weed back into how many barrels. That would be 40 or 50 whatever based on the dollar amount you give us. And if we start to get like really high number of requests, I can bring it back to you and we can always go to the fin com for reserve fund for the last 10 or 15 barrels or something, but let's let's see what kind of response we get.

00:04:00,229	S6:
Yeah, I like the idea of a $40 discount to 40 residents. That's that's my.

00:04:05,729	S2:
I like being consistent with one of them too, I mean, and not instead of saying that's what you you're at 40. Correct. Um, when I'm Jeremy.

Jeremy. 00:04:14,800	S3:
Yeah. I do know that the discount they're offering is $40. I don't know what their, um, cap is in terms, but I think I think it's typically 50 or 60, but I think Eric Mansfield would be able to sort of fill in on that. I can certainly shoot him another email and get that information if that's that's okay.

00:04:30,769	S4:
But I mean.

00:04:31,930	S1:
It's $40.

00:04:33,199	S2:
I don't know if we want to go 41.

00:04:34,529	S1:
The Great American rain.

00:04:35,399	S4:
Barrel.

00:04:36,600	S1:
The great American Pharoah barrel.

00:04:38,329	S2:
All right. I think a motion with a $40 discount cap to 2000 via the example is a good, uh, yeah, a good, um, program. So can I get a motion? Okay. Moved second.

00:04:51,829	S4:
Second.

00:04:52,399	S2:
Second by Tom. Any other discussion. All in favor?

00:04:57,629	S4:
All right.

00:04:59,129	S2:
Passes.

00:04:59,769	S4:
I can do it.

00:05:00,370	S5:
Thank you.

Jeremy. 00:05:00,930	S4:
Appreciate your help tonight.

00:05:02,430	S3:
Thank you so much for considering it. Thank you.

00:05:04,370	S4:
Yeah. Yeah, sure. There we go. All right.

00:05:10,430	S5:
So the next item on your agenda is to approve the language for the ballot question regarding the, um.

00:05:17,600	S4:
Oh, no.

Sorry. 00:05:18,199	S5:
Cell tower. Sorry, I'm reading ahead. Sorry about.

00:05:20,269	S4:
That.

00:05:21,529	S5:
I guess these reading glasses aren't strong enough.

00:05:24,199	S4:
Okay, let's.

00:05:24,870	S5:
Get right by that. Sorry. Um, review updated offer for cell tower release conference. This is really just a short discussion. Um, the great, uh, American cell tower company or something like that was, uh, interested in buying us out of our lease. They had increased their offer by about $29,000 to a total of $560,000. Um, Bill had done some back of the envelope math on the main, Uh, the main lease payment that we're getting. And then we just we just found out that, uh, Everest was shortened us. They were supposed to be paying us for a second, um, array on the tower since.

00:06:06,730	S4:
Just.

00:06:08,699	S5:
Since December 23rd. And, uh, so they owe us another $4,100, and that's a $321.97 per month additional lease payment on top of what they were already giving us.

00:06:22,170	S4:
Self-funded.

00:06:22,870	S5:
So, um.

00:06:26,470	S5:
I we've made Everest aware that that we were shorted and we're aware of it. They're working to get us the overage. We got that confirmation from the finance department today. They're going to make us whole and start to make the lease payment $321 more, or $320 more every month.

00:06:42,730	S1:
Uh, that's right there.

00:06:43,769	S5:
That's just the question becomes, do you want to continue, uh, negotiating with them? My position is that?

00:06:53,970	S5:
Chris Davis also said that he would take it back to his folks to see if we he could get us a better offer on that. Better than the 560.

00:07:01,800	S1:
Wait, so.

00:07:02,269	S4:
What's.

00:07:03,470	S1:
I guess I'm not up to speed.

00:07:04,699	S4:
All of it.

00:07:05,870	S1:
So instead of a yearly or monthly, it'd be A1A1 time.

00:07:10,370	S2:
Yeah, it'd be an early buyout.

00:07:12,000	S5:
Be an early buyout. So you would leave some money on the table, but you'd get a lump sum in excess of 500 in excess of $560,000.

00:07:21,730	S1:
And we don't lose any. And then what's the the length of it? The the the least days.

00:07:26,529	S4:
Gone.

00:07:27,170	S1:
At least.

00:07:28,300	S5:
So I think it was originally a 20 year lease, and I think we've been in it for about five years. So it was about 15 years left.

Um. 00:07:36,529	S2:
So the, the the tower, everyone knows the tower. The lead tenant who had Everest build it was rising. So they're the main tenant on there. When the contract was negotiated, we get what's called a revenue share from everyone who gets added up to three more carriers. So you've got the big carriers. Dish went on it. And that's the makeup they went on a little bit ago and it wasn't added. So that will continue to grow two ways one. Additional carriers will eventually go on it. And two there are escalators every year that that bring the least the end release amount up. So I did some math and look, you know, probably the full payout is over 800,000. Right. So do you take five for eight or do you keep going. And it's an asset. Um, in addition I don't know. We want not too soon, but we do have interest now in a second tower in town. And I think that adds leverage to that tower as well. So I think it'd be a little premature to sell out that asset when potentially we're growing something that's bigger and adding a second tower down the road.

00:08:35,529	S5:
Well, yeah. When once the second tower gets added, that might make the first site location more valuable.

00:08:40,830	S2:
Yeah. Because someone knows I have continuity.

00:08:42,929	S1:
For one money. If we got the money earlier, what would we use it for?

00:08:46,100	S2:
Well, if we had a need currently, that would be a good discussion to have.

00:08:49,929	S5:
Well.

00:08:51,000	S2:
Well, we always have needs, but.

00:08:52,129	S5:
You.

00:08:52,269	S4:
Know.

00:08:52,529	S5:
We always have needs.

00:08:54,330	S1:
If you look at one time, you could pay down a debt.

00:08:56,700	S5:
Well, that's exactly right. So, like, if we were going to get a lump sum payment of 560,000 or $700,000, you would want to use that ideally for something that would be a one time thing that some debt that we wanted to pay off earlier. But the way it goes right now just falls. We we we it's consistent and we know what we're getting so we can plan for it as regular revenue. And it goes into the general fund and we use it as part of balancing our budget. Yeah, that would stop being part of our regular revenue and would wind up being for a one time use.

00:09:24,700	S2:
It's another one time source like Arpa was or.

00:09:26,769	S1:
What, a year from now, all of a sudden we need the money. We could probably negotiate it.

00:09:29,669	S2:
I think it'll be more. Yeah, and they are. I mean, the industry, all these tower owners and lease owners are hitting municipalities right now because they know, you know, they could probably sell something out a little cheaper than they're going to pay out over the life. Um, and then they can negotiate with carriers and, you know, so. Well, pretty good Yeah.

00:09:48,429	S4:
Good.

00:09:48,870	S2:
It's a good. We have an asset, and I just don't think it's ready to sell it yet.

00:09:53,100	S4:
Yeah, I agree.

00:09:54,470	S5:
Um, especially where there's finally interest in building the second tower behind the public safety building. So that builds out our network a little bit. Makes it all a little stronger. It makes it more valuable.

So. 00:10:04,899	S2:
But I think, you know, down the road, we should have a discussion, you know, before we talk. And this is probably where you said the attachments and the nodes. I sat here and told you about other ways we could provide Wi-Fi and wireless through our downtown. If this second tower comes into play, you don't need any of that. So that's kind of I think that comes into play.

00:10:21,169	S1:
So, Joe, this deal could be made just with our vote or not.

00:10:26,200	S4:
Um.

00:10:27,169	S5:
I'd have to look into it. I'm not sure. I think the Select board has the authority you need. You need town meeting vote to set a 20 year. You need timing. Vote to set a 20 year lease, but I don't. I think you can break it.

00:10:37,600	S4:
There's a lot of.

00:10:38,029	S2:
Things we want to talk. If we did this like because then they own it, right? So then they well, can they come in and add things or do what they want? You know, so all of a sudden, as.

00:10:46,399	S1:
I say, the terms of the lease don't change. If they don't pay us monthly, they pay us one time.

00:10:49,769	S5:
Right?

00:10:50,169	S1:
Right. But we'd have to figure it out. But I agree, if it's not the right time.

00:10:52,570	S5:
To.

00:10:53,100	S2:
Pay right now, we control the ground. So they can't do too much without coming to us or even add somebody. But if they own it, I don't know what that does.

00:11:00,669	S1:
So I'm not in favor of.

00:11:02,230	S5:
Okay. That's the answer I needed. So I know what to tell Mr. Hamill when he calls again.

00:11:06,500	S2:
Well, let's get the dollar amount to. I don't wait till he tells you a dollar amount.

00:11:10,169	S5:
He told me his current offer is 560. Oh, I thought it went up. It went up. It went up 29,000. Chris Davis is going to go to his feet.

00:11:16,070	S2:
Tell him about the second tower.

00:11:17,970	S5:
Um, I did not.

Okay. 00:11:20,500	S2:
We'll follow up on that one.

00:11:22,269	S5:
Okay. I told Chris Davis about the second tower and did not tell him about the second. Um. All right, now we're on to the thing that I almost jumped ahead to.

00:11:29,769	S6:
Um, so we don't need to vote on that. No.

Okay. 00:11:34,370	S1:
Um, unless we want to vote.

00:11:36,799	S2:
I don't think so.

00:11:37,629	S6:
Okay. As long if we don't need you, that's fine.

00:11:40,399	S5:
So, uh, in front of you in the first page, short version. Here is the ballot question language that has to appear on the ballot on April 10th and tonight is the ninth. The board has to vote to accept that language so that it can go on to the ballot. Town Clerk Karen Kale is here. I've confirmed this language with the Superintendent of schools and their counsel several times. So you can.

00:12:08,029	S1:
Do you have.

00:12:08,370	S5:
That? You can do a dramatic reading if you want to make sure everybody knows what it is. I don't.

00:12:11,200	S1:
Have that. So is it it or is it.

00:12:13,600	S5:
No, it's this one.

00:12:14,600	S2:
Oh this one.

00:12:16,100	S5:
Yeah, I get it.

00:12:17,370	S1:
You want to read it for us?

00:12:18,470	S6:
Yeah.

00:12:18,730	S5:
Because you want me to read it for you.

00:12:20,629	S6:
We don't.

00:12:21,330	S5:
We don't. Shall the town of Hamilton be allowed to exempt from the provisions of proposition two on one and a half, so-called, the amounts required to pay the town's applicable share of the bond issued by the Hamilton Wenham Regional School District for the purpose of paying costs of a new Cutler Elementary School at 237 Asbury Street, Hamilton, mass. Including the payment of all costs, incidental or related thereto. So that is the form of the question that has to be on the ballot. There's a second separate question that will be in the warrant article on five days earlier. But you don't have to prove that until we close the warrant.

00:12:51,529	S6:
Um, is there any place to write the interest cost, or is that an all incidental?

00:12:57,429	S5:
Incidental? Related.

00:13:00,799	S7:
What was the address?

00:13:03,100	S5:
It just says the oh 237 has Street Hamilton.

00:13:06,230	S8:
Okay, I've heard that.

00:13:09,769	S1:
So what do we gotta do? Vote.

00:13:10,970	S5:
You gotta vote to accept it so it can be placed on the ballot. Do you have any motion? Do you have anything else to add, or are you good? Okay.

00:13:17,269	S1:
Make a motion to have the language for the ballot for the.

00:13:23,370	S1:
School district. Town. This school district. Member town. Ballot question.

00:13:29,570	S6:
Second.

00:13:31,129	S2:
All in favor?

00:13:33,029	S6:
Hi.

00:13:35,000	S2:
This is unanimously.

00:13:41,070	S5:
Sign this signed.

00:13:46,169	S5:
Sign it and send it up is signed by Alpha.

00:14:00,100	S2:
Two. But I'll send it that way.

00:14:02,799	S5:
Um, so, um, next item on the agenda while people signing, review the updated list of warrant articles for annual town meeting and town meeting calendar. Those are both in your packet. Uh, the only addition since the last time you reviewed the list of articles was the Adopt Special Energy Building Code article that Mr. Holt told you about during public comment. And, um, I already let you know that the building commissioner will be, uh, developing a list of bullet points to help the conversation both with you and the finca. And then, uh, a citizens petition question was entered in and certified by the clerk. The citizen's petition question would seek to offer town meeting voters an opportunity to renovate the elementary schools, not build a new one. So we'll have all that language together for all of these potential questions. Um, at the meeting on March 10th.

00:14:59,870	S1:
That position. Make it onto both.

00:15:03,529	S5:
I don't.

00:15:04,269	S1:
Want.

00:15:04,870	S5:
Uh, we believe that they did, but I can't be sure that. Okay. Uh, I haven't I haven't called one of them to confirm.

00:15:16,399	S1:
Was the link with the language. I'm assuming that our town council looks at the language of the one that.

00:15:23,169	S5:
We haven't given to him yet, but, I mean, citizen petition questions have to be entered the way they're, uh, they're submitted to the city's town clerk, and.

00:15:31,399	S6:
You know, but they can request that that our town council help them with the language.

Right? 00:15:35,899	S5:
Um, generally, we don't offer that because Is, then it gets into a position over. Is the town recommending the language and recommending the article, or is it? If it's supposed to be properly we don't. We don't generally offer that to people.

00:15:50,000	S6:
I've seen it done before. To to be honest, I can't remember the specifics.

00:15:55,000	S8:
It was a protocol that the town can do.

00:15:57,429	S6:
That was maybe about five years ago.

00:15:59,669	S1:
It wasn't a I think it was an amendment on the floor that our town council looked at that I'm not.

00:16:04,370	S6:
Yes, yes.

00:16:05,830	S1:
I don't know if it was, but yes, I just was curious.

00:16:07,570	S5:
I don't think it was a citizen's petition question.

00:16:09,470	S1:
Okay. Because there's an amendment on the floor.

Okay. 00:16:12,570	S6:
But that would be from a citizen, right?

00:16:15,029	S1:
Yeah.

00:16:17,429	S5:
But generally all they're doing is recommending that the amendment is to form. They're not commenting on the validity of it or anything else. They're only commenting to, to form as to form.

00:16:27,029	S6:
So exactly. And I agree with you 100%.

00:16:31,000	S9:
Can somebody read I, I'm a little surprised by the special energy thing. I haven't heard anything about it. So can somebody read what's going to be on the warrant with that?

00:16:40,629	S6:
It's not been entered yet. He just gave.

00:16:42,529	S2:
It. It's going to be on our next agenda to decide.

00:16:44,830	S8:
Okay. I thought you were talking about voting.

00:16:46,700	S9:
On that tonight. And I'm like, I don't even know what I got on. Okay, great.

00:16:50,700	S5:
Who this item was. This item on the agenda was just for discussion purposes, to update the board and where things stand. There will be no vote on any of this tonight.

00:16:57,769	S8:
Oh. Got it.

00:17:04,430	S2:
What about reports that we not part of this discussion, or are there any reports and discussion.

00:17:09,930	S5:
So the standard II articles of the topic should probably include reports of committees. But um, haven't been doing a lot of that lately, but I'll make sure it gets added in here.

00:17:23,099	S5:
The first couple are just standard budget items or worn articles that are on everyone. Yeah, but good. Thank you for reminding me. I'll make sure that gets added in.

00:17:38,269	S2:
It looks pretty good to me. What are you. What are your comments? Thoughts?

00:17:47,869	S1:
We got we got to do tonight.

00:17:50,400	S2:
We're just reviewing the list and discussing it. Is anything missing? You want to take a look at this?

00:17:56,869	S5:
If you have any. If you have any questions on any of these items before the meeting.

00:18:01,069	S6:
Neither can I.

00:18:01,869	S5:
Well, if you have any, if you have any questions on any of the items before March 10th, just let me know so we can get them answered for you prior to.

00:18:11,769	S2:
Just give me a minute to look at that.

Yep. 00:18:16,069	S5:
Yep.

00:18:48,069	S1:
Those articles are still in luck. Are they confirmed?

00:18:52,569	S5:
They're pretty confirmed. That might go down by one item. I think that the way I have the list written there right now kind of makes it look like one of the articles is almost repeated twice, but that was what we were originally given. I'm just letting.

00:19:05,769	S1:
It go by the planning board.

00:19:07,099	S5:
Yes.

00:19:08,069	S2:
So they've got any public hearings, everything they need to do ahead of it.

Yeah. 00:19:12,069	S5:
Yeah, they've they've already got them scheduled. They're already starting to address.

00:19:15,829	S2:
Yeah.

00:19:16,470	S5:
Yeah I think they've already done a lot of work in the Ado one for instance.

00:19:20,299	S2:
And there's nothing they were waiting for us to come and approve. Yeah.

Okay. 00:19:37,470	S1:
Open up an extension of the lease for Cutler and Winthrop. What is.

00:19:41,930	S5:
It? I think it's just Cutler. You extended Winthrop already. That was again entered as a placeholder months ago. And then we realized that Winthrop was already extended. And it's just a matter of, uh, extending the lease for 50 years, whether it's in school there or not.

00:19:58,630	S2:
It's a good.

00:19:58,930	S5:
Question. Yeah. Whether there's a new school there or just the old school. Their lease is up, so we're going to need to extend a lease to them.

Um. 00:20:06,930	S1:
It's not. You can't. You have to do that, Tommy. Yeah, no we didn't. We talked about it.

00:20:11,099	S5:
Because they're seeking a fifth year. They're seeking a 50 year extension on that one. I think what.

00:20:15,369	S1:
You you gave it.

00:20:16,869	S5:
You gave a 5 or 10 year lease to the Winthrop site because you're allowed to do that amount of time without a time to vote. But you did not address color. And Cutler is up. Whether it's a new school or it stays the way it is, it's going to need a new lease. So it needs a go to timing.

00:20:34,529	S2:
I think. I think Eric, when he came to that meeting, needed a commitment from the town to go back to the MSBA. Right. And that's what we voted on that.

Right? 00:20:43,599	S5:
Yeah.

00:20:49,930	S2:
Mister Bowl or anything from you on this topic?

00:20:52,869	S1:
Um, just, uh, my time will come.

00:20:56,599	S2:
I know, I'm looking forward to it. Any further discussion? I think that's good. Thank you, I appreciate it.

00:21:04,799	S5:
Thank you. George, I got mine and so I do, I do, I got my name.

00:21:08,670	S6:
So there's one thing in here form a vote for the regional school district. Is that going to be the warrant article?

00:21:18,730	S1:
Uh.

00:21:19,269	S5:
That's going to be that'll be that'll the warrant article that's in the packet is going to be with with you for the next meeting. It'll be on on the draft warrant for the next meeting.

00:21:28,200	S6:
Just because it's a little it's not quite clear. The amount that SBA is granting is what is it, 50 million? It's not 51%. So and we know that amount. So shouldn't that be in the in the article somewhere. So that we know so that residents know what the amount is going to be.

00:21:54,700	S8:
Mhm.

00:21:55,799	S5:
Okay.

Yeah. 00:21:56,599	S6:
Um I'll uh seems like a fair.

00:21:58,799	S2:
Well yeah I would assume it would. I mean I don't see the articles here. Where, where are you seeing that. I'm just looking at a list of articles.

00:22:06,329	S5:
And all the stuff that I gave you for one vote, you know, that it's it's it's in in the back. I included the ballot question, but also the other stuff.

00:22:13,329	S6:
So I have a vote for regional school district school committee voted.

00:22:23,269	S2:
Yeah. Let's make sure it's I'm sure. I mean, I don't know how many articles are they going to have.

00:22:26,970	S6:
Right. And that's that's important. They have they do have the amount of one 142,002.

00:22:33,730	S5:
66, 142,000,266.

00:22:36,569	S6:
34. And they're saying it's 51%, but that's not correct, because the amount that we've been told is 50 million.

00:22:46,200	S9:
So that's 35%. So I think it's very important as citizens to see. But I know I think I just wanted to encourage that as well, because if I heard 51%, I would think it's 70 million and not 50.

00:23:00,869	S6:
So that's not a fair. That's not a fair, accurate warrant.

00:23:05,000	S10:
I understand I think it needs to describe what the eligible costs are.

Right. 00:23:08,529	S2:
That's right.

00:23:09,200	S10:
Specifically right.

00:23:10,369	S2:
Because.

00:23:13,900	S2:
Not because there's costs that are not eligible. So they're not that they're excluding that. So yeah I would like to see you know they can leave that number. But also you know basically what's the net number anticipated.

00:23:26,000	S10:
Exactly right.

00:23:27,670	S2:
So well. Yeah. Good combat.

00:23:30,329	S10:
I think that is important. Including there.

00:23:33,430	S2:
You got that?

00:23:34,029	S10:
Yep.

Yep. 00:23:35,029	S6:
Yeah.

00:23:37,029	S2:
Okay. Um, I didn't look at that. I assume we're doing that. We'll go through.

00:23:41,869	S6:
The read on micro.

Micro? 00:23:43,730	S2:
When we go through all of these, and.

00:23:45,130	S5:
I'll have all that. We'll have all that ready for the meaning of the 10th when you finalize the warrant closure.

00:23:52,130	S2:
And then how does that whole discussion with the citizens petition come into play with? Well, someone.

00:23:57,569	S5:
I plan to give the citizen's petition to town council and have him at the meeting on the 10th so we can he can answer questions about the citizen petition question.

00:24:06,170	S2:
And that language is in here, too, and I just haven't read it yet on the petition or.

00:24:09,670	S5:
No, no, we do not. The only the only one that's in there is because it was it was included with stuff that we got from the schools about the ballot question. The only thing you had to vote on tonight was the ballot question. But not but I did give you all the other information.

00:24:19,430	S10:
Okay. That citizens petition was received by both towns.

00:24:22,299	S5:
I believe it was, but I haven't confirmed that the one in town clerk got it, but I my understanding was that that that was their intent.

00:24:29,000	S10:
Yeah.

00:24:29,569	S8:
Yeah.

00:24:31,299	S6:
And so, um, Joe, if they asked for town council to look at it as to form and not content, you, uh, you agree that that would be an okay thing to do? Just to make sure it's it. Is it too late?

00:24:51,000	S5:
If they had approached us before, they submitted it with signatures.

So. 00:24:56,730	S10:
You know, they can't change it.

00:24:58,829	S1:
So.

00:24:59,269	S5:
So the citizens that signed it to get it onto the onto the warrant as written, signed it as written. They would have needed to seek our advice in advance. And that's what I was saying before. Like, we've never really offered to do that in the past because when it comes to us, it's it's. That's how the petition has been signed.

00:25:14,329	S6:
Okay. Okay. So that if they had wanted to do that, that should have been something prior to the signatures.

00:25:21,500	S11:
Something on the floor of town meeting. Uh, Then.

00:25:26,400	S5:
John McGrath is.

00:25:27,200	S11:
Okay. From town to town.

00:25:29,299	S6:
Okay.

00:25:30,069	S5:
John McGrath is racing and I'm going to call him down. You can call him Dumbledore.

00:25:34,769	S6:
Okay. So. Okay, so that's. I mean, if they needed any help, I don't even know what it says yet, but. Okay. Thank you.

00:25:44,500	S5:
Dumbledore from Harry.

00:25:45,700	S2:
Potter. Oh, okay. I don't know that. All right. Hey, John, you got a hand raised? Go ahead. I don't know what Caroline calls you. So, what is it? Yeah.

00:25:55,670	S12:
Yeah. We generally like, uh, to invite, um, the, uh, citizens to, uh, upcoming fin con meeting, because we'll need to make a vote on the citizens petition. So, Joe, if you could forward me the name of, uh, whoever submitted it, we're going to. We'd like to invite them to the fin con meeting on this Thursday. Um, so we can understand, um, the the, uh, The petition.

00:26:26,369	S5:
Do you have? You have the petitioner. Can you? Can you? You have is a contact information. Yeah. If you can just afford it to me. Well, John, we'll get it. We'll figure it out. We'll get it to you.

00:26:37,700	S12:
That'd be great.

00:26:38,470	S10:
Thanks. Provide a cost estimate on the citizen's petition as well as part of your summary. Is that is that part of what.

00:26:44,500	S12:
You I mean, I, I have to I don't know what I mean. I'd be happy to work with whoever put it together, but this is the first I'm hearing of it, so I'm. Yeah, I'm happy to partner with the petitioners to try to put a cost number together if they haven't already done that.

00:27:01,369	S10:
Great.

00:27:02,599	S12:
So more than willing to you know, we usually bring in both sides of every warrant so we can understand both sides of each argument.

00:27:11,799	S10:
So yeah.

00:27:13,269	S12:
So they can reach out to me. That would be great.

00:27:17,269	S2:
So likewise should we invite them to a select board meeting.

00:27:20,369	S5:
That's up to you.

00:27:21,869	S2:
And I'd like to I mean I like the idea that I'm looking at the calendar now of what we have between now and.

00:27:27,369	S10:
I mean, it might be helpful. I mean, if they've already put together a cost estimate and they're willing to put a present on that, it might be helpful, you know, for everyone to.

00:27:34,730	S2:
At least maybe circulate it so we can see it and then see if there's something. But I, I would agree, give them an opportunity to come in and speak to it.

00:27:41,869	S10:
Yeah.

00:27:42,430	S12:
Yeah I would recommend doing that.

00:27:44,400	S2:
Yeah. Yeah. Let's try to get them on uh, one of the next three.

Yeah. 00:27:49,829	S5:
The 10th will have to be March 10th.

00:27:52,430	S13:
John I'm sending them the email with the content.

00:27:54,730	S5:
Can you copy me? Yeah. Uh, John, the town clerk is forwarding you the email right now.

00:28:00,430	S12:
Thanks.

00:28:01,930	S10:
What's that?

00:28:04,269	S5:
Okay.

00:28:05,930	S2:
So we're good on the calendar. Everything looks, uh. Everybody's up.

00:28:09,269	S5:
We're in. We're on track. There's no need to make any changes at the current time, so.

00:28:17,730	S2:
So we're all set for April 5th. Now, we've gotten some emails about a side room for kids and stuff. Is that something accommodated? We haven't passed.

00:28:28,200	S5:
We we're we're we're working on it. We have a meeting with, uh, there's some pieces that come along with some logistical pieces that go along with that. So H.W. cam, uh, town clerk, myself, uh, and some folks from the, uh, the Voting Clicker company are going to be meeting, uh, a week from Wednesday. So March 5th, uh, via zoom to kind of go over what the logistics are, what needs to be handled out. We think we can accommodate what the requesters are looking for. Um, but we just want to have a meeting to close the loop on that.

00:29:01,799	S2:
Okay. Thank you.

00:29:04,430	S5:
We're making every effort to accommodate the request, and I'm I'm optimistic, to be honest.

00:29:11,869	S2:
All right. Any other discussion on the calendar? Uh, the Warren articles. We will walk through all of them at some point on the 10th, right?

00:29:22,400	S5:
Yes.

00:29:25,000	S2:
All right. Um, next on the agenda is the approval date for a special town meeting in June. Discussion vote. I don't know from our earlier discussion on unfunded mandate.

00:29:36,930	S5:
I had a motion, Mister Olson.

00:29:38,400	S1:
At the table.

00:29:39,730	S5:
Um, is there a second?

00:29:41,670	S6:
Second.

00:29:42,799	S2:
All in favor? I do want to kind of talk availability for this group, though, to maybe have an executive session to further discuss. I don't know.

00:29:53,930	S5:
Yeah. Town council recommended if you're going to discuss the issues related to the unfunded mandate claims, we should have that in executive session because it's going to lead to litigation. So they recommended doing an executive session. You could do that as late as prior to the meeting on the 10th. Or you could do that sometime between now and the 10th when you all think you'll be available. And I'll get somebody.

00:30:17,930	S2:
Either ahead of the 10th or a zoom call? Probably. Right.

Probably. 00:30:22,299	S5:
It could probably be a zoom call anyways.

00:30:23,970	S1:
Exactly. The other thing we're going to talk about was the, uh, shared train station. And ah.

00:30:30,569	S5:
So we included that stuff in our comment letter to the.

00:30:33,529	S1:
To HLC. But we do. We need to make it part of a more formal request or not.

00:30:41,599	S5:
So the the comment comment period for regulations was over in the on Friday. And that was we took ideas about things to put into that kind of letter explaining, you know, the real world circumstances that, uh, impact Hamilton. And that was one of the arguments that we made in the recommendations that we made in the.

00:30:59,500	S1:
Book, to wait for a response where we get legal. Is that what you're saying?

00:31:02,170	S5:
No. The the legal aspect comes up because the auditor has.

00:31:08,269	S6:
Declared it.

00:31:09,099	S5:
Declared for three towns request.

00:31:11,200	S1:
I get it. But when they come back and say no, you're responsible for all of the thing and you only have half the land, then we're going to file a lawsuit against them. Something you want to do? Prep for that sooner or later.

00:31:21,299	S6:
Well, they're going to do more.

00:31:22,630	S5:
We're going to talk about lawsuits. Let's talk about that executive session. Let's talk about that.

00:31:27,230	S1:
That was my point. My point is to incorporate both legal things.

00:31:30,029	S5:
We could we could we could talk counsel.

00:31:31,569	S1:
That was.

00:31:31,930	S5:
My question.

00:31:32,329	S8:
Yeah.

00:31:32,730	S6:
All right, we'll do it.

00:31:33,829	S8:
Yeah.

00:31:34,170	S2:
So they're available on the 10th, or.

00:31:36,369	S5:
They'll be available on the.

00:31:37,299	S2:
10th. Is there a preference, uh, to put it?

00:31:39,170	S6:
I would rather do it before, because there might be a lot of issues to talk about. And I'm up for zoom, but I and I would I'm up for it one evening next week. I don't know what.

00:31:53,269	S2:
Yeah. I'm very I'm flexible if it's if it's at night.

00:31:55,769	S1:
So can we do a zoom.

00:31:57,630	S2:
And a zoom?

00:31:58,099	S1:
Yeah, we.

00:31:58,299	S5:
Can do it. We can do the zoom.

Yeah. 00:32:00,230	S1:
Yeah, I'm pretty flexible. So do you.

00:32:03,029	S2:
Want to check availability for a night or two next week we can send back to this crew and we'll nail.

00:32:07,930	S5:
Yeah. Look, if it's okay with the board, I'll inquire with town council when they're available. Get a couple nights to send back to you, and then we'll. We'll nail it down.

00:32:15,470	S2:
Perfect.

00:32:16,230	S10:
Okay.

00:32:17,500	S2:
Thank you.

Joe. 00:32:20,569	S2:
All right. Any new business?

00:32:23,730	S5:
I have one item.

00:32:24,670	S1:
I have one item.

00:32:25,500	S2:
Okay. Mr.

Olson. 00:32:28,670	S1:
When I signed an amicus brief about, like, a federal funding law. Is that something that we wanted to look at? Why did they do that? And something we talked about.

00:32:39,369	S5:
Uh, that was not done. We were looking at it. We were considering it, and we chose. And the judge in the case said that they weren't going to accept him because he's okay. So there was no opportunity to do it. Okay. So that's why it's not on your agenda. I've been thinking about it. And then we got told the judge said no, so there's no reason to bring it up.

Yeah. 00:32:58,869	S2:
Good job.

00:33:00,500	S5:
Um.

00:33:01,430	S2:
You, sir?

00:33:02,529	S5:
Yeah. Um, so the principal of high school, this just came in this morning, actually, so it didn't have time to advertise it. It is new business. You can wait until the 10th, but I want to make you aware of it. Or you. I think it's a minor issue if you wanted to take it up, I think you could probably get away with it. I will read directly from the email from Principal Brian Mengoni. Like last year, we would like to place yard signs of our graduates on one A. We would put the signs in similar locations from Paton Park down towards Rochdale. Do you need me to come to a board meeting to make this request or can make it for me? So that's up to the board. If you want Brian to come in and discuss it with you. I know it was pretty well received in the community last year.

00:33:40,869	S1:
I will be the consent agenda next. Next meeting.

00:33:43,430	S5:
Consent agenda. Next meeting. You got.

00:33:44,769	S8:
It.

00:33:45,000	S6:
Oh, could we do a motion right now?

00:33:46,670	S1:
No, we can't.

00:33:47,099	S8:
Vote.

00:33:47,829	S6:
No because it's new business.

00:33:49,599	S2:
Just let him know. No need to come and that will approve it at our next meeting.

00:33:53,829	S5:
Got it? We'll do.

00:33:55,299	S14:
We'll take it out.

00:33:58,799	S2:
All right. That last motion. Anyone want to make it?

00:34:01,700	S6:
Make a motion to adjourn.

00:34:03,269	S1:
Second.

00:34:04,230	S2:
All in favor?

00:34:05,069	S8:
Aye.

00:34:06,200	S2:
It's a wrap.

835. 00:34:08,369	S8:
Thanks, everybody.